Karrion Kross (@realKILLERkross) is a professional wrestler currently signed to WWE. He sits down with Chris Van Vliet in Ontario, CA to talking about meeting Jesse Ventura and doing his impression of him, his new character in WWE and where the inspiration came from, having Snoop Dogg call his matches at WrestleMania 40, the idea behind The Final Testament, rumored heat with Bobby Lashley, if he sees a return to NXT in the future and more!

Quote I’m thinking about: “You either quit or keep going. They both hurt. Choose wisely.”

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On impersonating Jesse Ventura in front of Jesse Ventura:

“I was telling my brother, there’s something about him for me personally that’s refreshing, because he’s like authentically unapologetic. Especially with media nowadays, being in front of a camera is sometimes for a lot of people like walking through a minefield. To just be honest and just to say what you’re thinking and to say what you’re feeling, you’re not sure there’s always this dark cloud or concern that it’s going to bother someone. Jesse Ventura does not care at all.”

On the impression:

“I was concerned he was gonna feel like it was patronizing. If I had a guy sit in front of me for two hours doing me, I’d be like do you want me to throw you down the stairs? Let’s go. I lost the nerve to do it longer than I did in front of him. But then also, the little kid of me was alive and well being in front of him.”

On learning the impression:

“Watching wrestling as a kid my friends and I would all sit down in front of the TV and we would just do impressions of everybody whenever they were on TV. It was just like a thing we put into practice just to pop each other in the room. And it was something we were always able to do. I’ve always notoriously been the guy with my close friends, if you happen to not pick up my call, you’re getting an insane voicemail from somebody. It might be Macho Man, it might be Jesse Ventura. I don’t know, it’s not planned. It’s just there.”

On his current character:

“This rendition of the character that we’re doing right now, for me personally, is the most repulsive to bring to life, because it’s a bit of Sean O’Hare, who was one of my favorites. Also Kevin Sullivan as well, who doesn’t get the love and credit he deserves. A lot of what I’m doing with this character is like the opposite of a love letter. It’s kind of a hate letter to all of the terrible things people just kind of say to each other, the way they behave. Being a deceptive person is probably the most rotten thing you could possibly be in life, and if you’re looking to create a heel that can play off of anyone and do anything and functionally in a television format, someone who can reward the viewer for watching the show episodically and paying attention to the stories that they’ve told for 10, 20, 30 years, this is the perfect character as a heel. Because I can talk about Woods’s past, I can talk about Kofi’s past, and at the same time, I can also bring up vile things that maybe toxic fans have to say about, you know, this guy’s better than the other. I was trying to do this with Dawkins and Montez, and it’s a fine line to walk. But it was funny, there was one thing that a fan had said, I don’t want to say who it was about, because I don’t want to bring it back to life. But there was something online a fan said about someone I’d been working with while I’ve been doing this version of the character. I read it, I went, Oh, that’s disgusting. I’m going to use that. I’m going to use that it’s so vile and so untrue that of course when I say this, it’ll actually put the fans on the side of the babyface, which is ultimately what I’m trying to do. I cannot win people overdoing this. This is the opposite. Then I said it, and I just out of curiosity, I couldn’t help myself. I had to go online to see because they’re one of the people that do the thing on Twitter every week. And then he went and said the total opposite. I was like, who’s the psychopath here? This is this guy’s tweet. He said this two weeks ago about him, and he’s pretending he didn’t say it. I was like wow, that’s crazy. I should be this guy in wrestling. I should want to look like a lunatic. I should be this guy. But some things that I’ve said to the babyfaces while I’ve been doing this character, I’ve heard people in this business and other businesses kind of saying to each other, and I’m drawing from real places, and I’m just kind of reformatting it to make it become sort of a conversation piece, and it’s an effort to add depth to the people that I’m working with, and for people to say, Oh, I know what he’s trying to do. He’s trying to conquer and divide. This is the dividing part. He wants to weaken them. But he does have a point, and there’s a story to build from there, it creates an obstacle for the babyface to overcome in that story.” 

On running it by his opponents first:

“Oh yeah, I’m not an ambush artist. I don’t like people who do that. If I’ve ever had to deal with people like that, I usually throw them down the stairs. I find the nearest staircase, and somehow they wind up doing like a Logan Paul backflip down the stairs. I don’t know how it happens. It just happens. But, yeah, I’m not one of those people at all. I will get with the people, and I’ll say, hey, is there a period in your career that we can highlight, in this particular realm that we can bring to life? I think it’s very carny, and it’s sort of like, I don’t know. If you’re secure with what you’re doing and you really believe that you’re worth it, you won’t try to ambush somebody you’re working with.”

On character inspiration:

“I don’t necessarily know that I have one, but I will say that Jeffrey Dean Morgan’s Negan, his character from The Walking Dead, when he was a villain with some really evil stuff, he had a particular way. He would kind of stare through people and smile at awful stuff. [Also], His name is at the tip of my tongue, There Will Be Blood, Daniel Day Lewis. There was a minute where I was doing the mustache over the top lip, and a lot of people thought it was like an ode to Jake Roberts. But I think I’ve told you this before. I’ll look up film study and workshops from actors that’ll be online, and I’ll always kind of study that stuff and convert it to wrestling. There’s something about when you grow a mustache, or if you have any sort of beard that’s an obstruction over your mouth, people read body language, and they read facial expressions. And when you conceal what your mouth is doing when you’re talking, it makes people sort of uncomfortable. It’s not a natural read when you’re talking to them. So if you have that over the top lip and you smile, and it’s a close smile, there’s there’s something off putting about it. So I literally did that on purpose, just to lean into the presentation of the character. My wife couldn’t handle it anymore. I was like please just put up with it a little bit more. And she was just like, you look so awful. You look like an awful, evil, scumbag human being. I was like, Yeah, but it’s the point. [She said] But there’s another six days of the week to see this character walking around the house. And I was like, Okay, I can’t handle that anymore either, so we got rid of it.”

On fans of NXT Karrion Kross wanting to see him do more:

“Have patience. Bear with me. I’m trying. Again the minefield that is being in front of the camera and trying to be as open and honest as possible. I could say exactly how I feel about it, what I’d like to do. I’m sure people could imagine, and they could also imagine it will irk people at work for me to be like, Hey, I’m aware of what you want to see out of me, ultimately, truly what you want to see out of me. I’m always trying to find a way to make both parties happy. I’m the wrestler, not the writer or the director for a lack of better words, I know, believe me.”

On the formation of The Final Testament:

“So for quite some time, I had several people in creative tell me that there was an idea being entertained of me leading a group. They had a bunch of people that they were interested in putting together with us, and I had a certain set of people that I was interested in bringing in. Maybe at this time, I don’t say who, but one day I will say who, because I don’t want it to be taken the wrong way, people wind up getting disappointed and whatever. But someone had mentioned to me that AOP was on the roster with Paul Ellering, and I was like, wait what? Since when? Apparently they’ve been there for a while. They’re looking for the right time to bring them into the fold. And they said, Okay, we can try that for sure. So we all meet at the Performance Center and we start shooting these cryptic vignettes, it was almost like Iron Man 3 with The Mandarin when he had all the TVs behind him, Ben Kingsley, and he’s like, they’ll never see me coming, these propaganda videos. It was really cool. I loved the setup. And initially the direction we were going in was sort of like, almost like a militia occult group. I’ve always been one to try to stay away from reoccurring archetypes. There’s nothing wrong with reoccurring archetypes in professional wrestling and films and movies and all that, they just they are what they are. There’s reoccurring archetypes and the whole stories in the world relating to now. But I wanted to kind of present something new to people, something fun with some nostalgia callbacks, and, yeah, that’s kind of how it started. We’ve gone in some different directions. At one point, they were like, we kind of want you to be like a mixed martial arts group. I was like, that’s not a good idea. When you think about the times that we’re being given to work, a mixed martial arts type of wrestler would be good in a 20 to 30 minute format, because now you have time to get into the holds and stuff. When you put people in holds and you’re doing submissions and stuff, it’s a lot of flat time. So if the show’s moving quick and we want to keep the action going, what am I going to do? Put on a knee bar for three seconds? All of us can do all of that stuff, but we thought leaning more into the character direction rather than that would be a better thing to do. I wish we had 20 or 30 minutes. I would have walked down to Ken Shamrock’s music, give me the whole thing!”

On WrestleMania 40:

“That was amazing. Hard to put into words. My biggest takeaway from that was walking onto the stage and just looking at a full house, the setup, I’m with my wife, everything her and I have been through, me growing up as a kid. I got Akam and Rezar next to me, I don’t warm up to people very easily, but they’re like family to me. Now we have the same sense of humor about stuff. Paul Ellering is next to me. I grew up watching Paul Ellering, I just couldn’t believe it. I was like we finally made it. We finally did it. It was such an uphill battle, and I’m so glad it was because that made it even more like, wow, we really earned this. I remember looking at my wife and always going through the curtain, I’m in character mode. I hypnotize myself, almost like, dare I say, possess myself to become somebody else for that performance, to bring the Kross character to life. For that one moment, I was just like, Kevin is on the stage looking at his wife, Elizabeth. I looked her right in the eyes, and I just said, I love you, and I’ve never, ever done that, ever. For me, that was the moment I wanted to take that in as me. I wanted to just have that brief second, just for me and for her to remember, it was awesome, and that’s such an understatement. I wish I could find better words. But especially after everything her and I together had been through too. I remember getting a call from one of my relatives after the show, and he’s like, You know what happened to you when you got called up from NXT, and when you went to Raw and they gave you the weird outfit, and he got booked into oblivion, and then you got released, and then you got called back. Now you just did WrestleMania. He was like, you know how many people would have folded from that you should wear that period in time of your career as a badge of honor to virtually have been sabotaged and driven off. You knew what you were doing, and you just went back to the indies, you got over and you got called back, and then you did WrestleMania. That doesn’t happen, that doesn’t happen to people. I never looked at it that way. I don’t even know if I went to bed that night. I was in such a good place after the show, and I had my mom and dad in the crowd. It was a really, really, really good day.”

On Snoop Dogg calling the match:

“I had a list of insane weapons that I wish got approved for that match. It was Philly, I was in love with ECW, Heyman got inducted into the Hall of Fame. I had all kinds of crazy stuff. One of the weapons on the list was Al Snow’s head. I would have loved to have hit Snoop Dogg right in the head with head. That would have been my move. I would have done a flying tope out of the ring flying at Snoop Dogg over the table to hit him. That would have been great.”

On Snoop Dogg’s hilarious calls:

“I laughed at the whole thing. I there was something that the girls did that night. I think it was when Scarlet hit B-Fab with the garbage can. Such a natural reaction. You knew it was genuine. What do you do? You see that another girl hits another girl with a garbage can.” 

On the supposed heat with Bobby Lashley:

“I hate that I’m saying this. But zero [heat], it was a work. He knows I feel this way about him. It’s not the first time I’m saying it. And unless you would have asked me about this, I would have never said it. I love that dude to death. After the match, I wanted to tell him afterwards so he didn’t think I was trying to butter him up before we went out. I told him after the match was done, expressed how much I love him, how much I’ve looked up to him, what an honor it was to work with him. I remember when WWE brought ECW back. People can say whatever they want about it. I thought his section of being ECW Champion was awesome. I loved it. I was a bit of an ECW snob growing up. I was like, oh, ECW originals! I didn’t care. He was like, no, he’s awesome. He looks like the f*cking Hulk, and he’s diving out of the ring and doing crazy stuff. He’s putting people through tables and stuff. And then, for me personally, fast forward now I’m working Mania with him. I told him all that at the end of the match. On the way to that Mania match, Bobby and I were constantly trying to find ways to intensify the conflict. Respectfully, we just felt like there were certain things on the way there that felt redundant. And it’s not me being salty about anything, it’s just him and I wanted to make this as intense and as crazy as possible. He had an idea to try to blur the lines on the way there, to make it feel as real as possible. There was even one time Bob was like, ‘You know what we should do? All these guys, they like to talk and they like to run to the dirt sheets and stuff. Dude, we should fight at the beginning of the show. We should get in a fight because all these guys are going to go and call the dirt sheets and tell them that we actually had a fight, and it’s going to stir people up into what we’re doing on TV.’ I was like, ‘Bob, what? Hold on a sec. First of all, what happens if nobody breaks up the fight?’ And he was like, damn, I didn’t think about that. I go, Yeah. And also, what happens if we get fired? Because what are we going to do? Hunter’s going to pull us aside and be like, what’s wrong with you guys? [We say] Oh, it’s just a work. And he’s like, You guys are bleeding, what are you doing? Then just the whole logical process of having to explain that it was a work and hoping that the office would have been okay with it, that we did that, and then it spilling. I was like let’s hold off on this idea. I said, I love crazy stuff like this, but please, let’s hold off on that idea.”

On a scrapped WrestleMania spot:

“Him and I were every single week trying to make this as insane as humanly possible. I’m glad I didn’t in retrospect [but] he wanted me to Power Bomb him out of the ring and through a table at Mania. He wanted me to give him a running Power Bomb out of the ring through [a table] he was ready to put his neck and everything on the line. I was like, ready to do thumbtacks. I said, if they let me set a table on fire, like we’re ready to do barbed wire, we’re ready to do all kinds of crazy stuff. And maybe it is a good idea that we didn’t do it. I don’t want to promote that it’s the best thing to give to people. There’s a lot of things that could go wrong. You get a barbed wire in your eye. What if you get a barbed wire in your balls? Think about that or a thumbtack in the nut. So I don’t know. But yeah there was zero issues.”

On thinking about possibly returning to NXT:

“Sometimes I do, but the truth of the matter with that is, in my opinion, NXT is a program where they’re attempting to build new stars. They want to create stars for the future. Somebody could encourage me to selfishly say yes and try to pander to an audience listening and make them feel like that’s something that they want. I know what it’s like being someone coming up trying to get at something you’re after. And it sucks when somebody comes in who’s already had their shot, who’s already been there, who was already basically given everything you could possibly want, undefeated with a championship, and you got the whole thing, it’s like they’re coming back in here. Now that spot is unavailable for someone who really needs it to move into. I’m so grateful and so proud of my work at NXT, but for the sake of everybody else down there I don’t think I should be down there doing it. If I were to come back for a match that people would want to see like a one off, some sort of program that would be fun to watch, that’s different. But to go back down there and chainsaw through everybody like, that’s not going to help them. It would help me and people would love it. I’d make sure they love it. There’d be a body count. There’d be bodies everywhere. There’d be people flying down the stairs. But for the functionality of the program, there’s new people coming up, and the business needs those people. They’re learning and they’ve got all the best minds down there.”

What is Karrion Kross grateful for?

“That I get to travel the world with my wife, that a relative of mine is doing well and to be here talking to you.”

Charles Wright (@TheGodfather) is a retired professional wrestler and WWE Hall of Famer. He sits down with Chris Van Vliet in Las Vegas to discuss his wrestling career as Papa Shango, Kama and The Godfather, his first memories of working with The Undertaker and The Rock, why he hated The Goodfather and Right To Censor, why he missed his cue in the main event of WrestleMania 8, being Owen Hart’s scheduled opponent for Over The Edge, receiving a Hall of Fame induction and more!

Quote I’m thinking about: “Dreams are not what you see in your sleep, they are the things that don’t let you sleep.” – Cristiano Ronaldo

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On making life changes:

“In the last year I’ve had my hip and my knee replaced. When I started I was 310. Now I’m about 240-250 and I feel great. I hope I look great, but I feel great. But I’ve really changed how I eat, when I eat, what I eat, and have really changed a lot about my lifestyle.”

On what has changed the most:

“I try not to eat sugar and keep my carbs down. I don’t eat past five o’clock at night. I don’t eat till 10 o’clock. I keep the shots of Jack Daniels to a minimum unless Taker is around, I’ll call him Taker not Mark. No bread, no fast food. Not because it’s unhealthy. But for some reason as I’ve gotten older, I don’t like red meat. Nothing about being grass fed. Every time I do these autograph signings on the weekends, we always look for barbecue spots. Everybody always wants to take me to barbecue spots, which is cool. But then I get turkey or I get chicken and they’re like, Dude, you gotta get the ribs, you gotta get the brisket, but I’m just it’s kind of weird. I can’t explain.”

On cutting back on alcohol:

“I don’t think you were there when Taker did his show here in Vegas. We talked about it, but I made a complete fool of myself drinking that day. Since then, I’ve had a different outlook on drinking Jack. So can I drink? Yes, I can drink a lot, unfortunately. But I tried to drink as little as possible.” 

On early memories of The Undertaker:

“When I met him I was a full blown biker. When I met him, it was hard for me to understand why this big white dude didn’t drink Jack, didn’t listen to country music, didn’t ride Harleys didn’t have tattoos. I just couldn’t understand it because the crowd of people at that time in my life, were hardcore bikers. And so I just tell people that I opened his eyes up to a different way of life. And that son of a gun took to it very well.”

On the first time he met The Undertaker:

“I just worked a programme with Lawler they didn’t know what to do with me. I’m as green as Kermit the Frog. Taker has been in the business a couple years now. So they said hey, we’re gonna bring this big, tall white kid into work against you. He’s been in the business a couple years. Maybe we can do something with you. So Mark’s driving in from Texas. I never get a chance to meet him. Everything I’ve done so far is what Jerry Lawler has told me to do in the ring. I know nothing. Just what somebody’s telling me what to do, which is a whole other story. So I met him in the ring. We have a match where I really think I’m like, Oh, here’s another one he’s big ass white boys I’m gonna have to deal with, so it was a little physical in the ring with me and him. He tells me to throw him out. So I throw him out. I go after him. I’m chasing him around one corner the other corner. I guess he found that chair which was what he was looking for. He hit me over the head with a chair so hard that you know the cartoons when you see the stars and little birdies? I swear I see that. And he looked down at me said do you want to do this easy way or the hard way? I said I think let’s do this the easy way and from that point we became really good friends from that day.” 

On The Godfather being similar to his own personality:

“The best thing for me is Godfather. Because Godfather is me. Being a pimp or all that is besides the point. It was so nice to be able to just be you. And Godfather is me. I mean, you know me now, you been around me, I act like this all the time. I don’t act hard. I don’t act mean. I try to be funny. And I just enjoy life now which has made me a better person. So I mean, everything is basically come to just the pinnacle for me was being The Godfather and being able to be myself on TV. I don’t know if you know this was never scripted ever. Back then they would not ask me what I was going to say anytime I had carte blanche. Isn’t that crazy? It’s pretty wild. They just wanted me to entertain them.”

On becoming Papa Shango:

“The WWE hired me. I had a tryout, I was in Germany for a year, when I got back from Germany they gave me a call and were like we want to give you a tryout. So I go for a tryout. Vince hires me and he says, You got a body of a monster, but you have a baby face. He goes, so we want you to just go home keep training because at that point, I had lost like 70 pounds trying to get in shape. He goes go home, relax. Then he called me one day and says Charles, I want you to go rent the movie Live and Let Die, there’s a voodoo character in there. It’s a James Bond film. And I already knew the film and the character. I was already familiar with everything. And he goes most importantly, I want you to get this guy’s laugh down. When you address the people you [laugh]. Yeah, but that’s where it came from. They wanted to hide my face because they thought I had a baby face.”

On why Papa Shango couldn’t continue:

“Papa Shango went through a very, very ugly divorce. My second wife. I went through an ugly divorce, I was in a very, very bad place. Biker Bear came out. Back then mind you, there’s no social media, there’s no laptops. I don’t even think there was ESPN. So there’s nobody taking pictures of you on your phone. But I was getting into a lot of fights, real fights and Taker was pulling me off for people, and it was getting ugly. So I went in there with Vince and Mark and we decided it would be best if I went home and got my mind right before somebody got hurt. I know that’s wild, but I was a different person back then.”

On how long before he came back:

“I’m not sure. The thing about me is I always had the luxury of being either part of a strip club or part owner of a strip club. So I always had money coming in, that could have been one of my problems. Wrestling for me, the money’s great, but wrestling for me was to have fun. When I was not having fun, I would go to Vince and say, Vince, I’m not making much money. I’m going through the tables every night with the Dudleys, I hate this travel. I could be at home looking at naked women making this much money. Vince was so cool with me, he would let me go and then they would call me back and I’d be like, Nah, I’m not ready to come back. And the reason they got me to come back as Kama is they offered me a Harley. I’m like if I could ride a Harley, I’ll come back and then only had it for a short time he took it away from me because it was crazy. They were renting him at the time before Vince had access to a bunch of Harley’s and said let’s say took the Harley away from me as Kama. I was done. And as Godfather once they made me Goodfather I was done. Vince was fighting for me the whole time believe me, Vince like Godfather I’m fighting for your bro. But they were getting rid of the DX and the suck it and the puppies and the Val Venis’s and they were going more and more PG. And finally they can only go so far with me so when Vince says Charles, we’re gonna do this and that and all I said was, so no more Ho’s? All I heard was no more Ho’s. He goes Charles, no more ho’s. I’m like, well finish me up I’m done. He’s like wait a minute. So we would work out a programme, we did that and then I was done.”

On his wife coming up with The Godfather persona:

“I wanted to be a mean pimp. Yeah I wanted to be a mean one. And then she’s like, No, let’s go this route. And she basically said, instead of trying to act to be something that you’re not, just go out there be your high as crazy self and have a good time at this point of your life. And once people see that side of you, they’re gonna love you because they’re gonna see it’s genuine. And you gotta love The Godfather. And that’s why I went to Vince and I told him I’m like, Vince, these people see enough wrestling. They really do. I’m like let me go out there and just entertain them. And that’s what I did.”

On seeing something special in The Rock:

“Yes. I was put in The Nation just because of him. I was put in The Nation to make it bigger and blacker and make it more strong. Because I came in I was supposed to be Papa Shango. And Vince literally called me to the office and says, change of plans. We’re gonna do this, or we’re gonna do that. And I’m like, what? And I’m like let me ask you a question. I make the same right? He goes yes, you do. Well I’m down! I didn’t want to put that face paint on anyway.”

On The Goodfather:

“When it happened, like I said, I was done. I told Vince finish me up. Then the jokester that he is, he put the tag team belts on me and Bull and kept me there even longer. He was more poking fun out of them, he was hoping that maybe we can get back to The Godfather in some form. They tried to bring The Godfather back but it just didn’t work because I was no longer a pimp, there were no longer hoes, you couldn’t talk about smoking weed, just couldn’t. People didn’t want that, they wanted The Godfather.”

On Right to Censor:

“On a shoot, nobody hated it more than me. As much as Ric Flair is Ric Flair, The Godfather is me and it was just you took it away from me and it just like oh. It took the air out of it and I was done. I just I did my best and RTC just the music alone had serious heat. I did my best but that was the only time in wrestling that I really wasn’t happy and I was just waiting for it to come to an end.”

On what really happened at WrestleMania 8:

“All right, I’m Papa Shango. I’m just happy to be there. They’re building me and I got thrown in that position. So they tell me, and I think it was in Indy? Wherever it was, was a long, long run. So they told me do not go. It was Gorilla Monsoon, God rest his soul, I’ll say his name now. It was Gorilla Monsoon. That’s why you always hear Gorilla Position. And he said, Do not go until we tell you to go. So I’m sitting here like, okay, and all I knew was what I had to do, when I got there, what I had to do, what happened before that after that I wasn’t concerned with, I just knew what I had to do when I got there. So I’m sitting there like a track star and then all sudden he goes, Oh, go go! They gave me a late cue. They’re not used to giving people cues. They are used to us being professionals and take it off on your own. So he forgot for a minute. That was that.”

Why do they think it’s on you?

“I don’t know. You’d have to ask them. But the funny thing is, I never heard about it ever from anybody until I was done wrestling, doing autograph signings, and people would be like, Hey, what happened? Why were you late? And I’m like, What do you mean was I wait? Because I never watched the match after I just knew what I had to do when I got there. And yeah, so I never heard about it until later. The reason I never heard about it was because it wasn’t my fault. Gorilla is probably like I gave the cue late, dammit. Sorry. I ran as fast as I can, it’s a long run.”

On his Hall of Fame induction:

“Mark Corrano called me, I’m still under a legends contract with the WWE, I’ve been on it since 2003. A long time. Back then you’d go to WrestleMania every year, you might not see you on TV, but you were doing signings and what have you. So I was on my way to the gym and Mark Corrano called me. And he’s like, you’re coming to WrestleMania, right? And I’m like, Yeah, I’m coming. He’s like, you bringing your family? I’m like, Well, why would I bring my family? No, I’m just coming by myself. He’s like, Well, I just want to let you know, this is the first time you’re on the ballot and Vince said definitely we’re putting you in Hall of Fame. I’m like no way really? Yeah, that’s how the call came. So that was really cool.” 

On Over The Edge:

“I don’t remember. I remember spending the day with Owen. I remember talking with the girls and then Owen was coming out. I’ve never seen it. But when that happened, I was behind the curtain with the girls going through it. [I said] ‘Don’t worry if you mess up, if you fall, I’ll do this.’ I was telling them that then whoever it was, it might have been Bruce Prichard, I don’t know who was sitting at the table. I know it wasn’t Jim Ross. He goes ‘Owen fell!’ And then I’m like, what? He goes, ‘Owen just fell!’ We were looking at the monitors and then it all went down. I just remembered what Owen looked like when he came through the curtain. And other than that, I don’t [remember].  I called my wife right away and she tells me a lot of things that I said that I don’t remember. But she tells me you said this and you said that. And then I’m like well, I don’t remember that. So it was a blur after that. I don’t remember how or when I found out that there was no match or what’s going on. I really don’t remember.”

On the Raw after Over The Edge:

“I remember more about the next night. They had set up matches and Vince said you guys I’m gonna set these matches up if you want to work, [then] work, if you don’t want to work, don’t work. But I got a show to do basically. I was matched up against Road Dogg without any rehearsal. So we went out there and we didn’t know what we’re going to do. We both basically said screw this man. Let’s go downtown and smoke joint for Owen and let it go with that. And that’s what we did.”

What is The Godfather grateful for?

“My family, my dogs and the fact I got to meet a lot of good people.”

Jonathan Coachman (@Thecoachrules) is a former WWE personality and commentator. He sits down with Chris Van Vliet at West Coast Creative Studio in Hollywood, CA to discuss his time in WWE, his new wrestling podcast “Behind The Turnbuckle“, why he thinks he took one of the best Stone Cold Stunners of all time, competing in 30 televised matches against the likes of Shawn Michaels and Randy Orton, wrestling Ric Flair in Afghanistan, who he thinks John Cena’s final opponent will be, how much he was yelled at by Vince McMahon while on commentary, falling off his chair when Kane’s pyro went off and more!

Subscribe to Behind The Turnbuckle here: https://www.youtube.com/@BehindTheTurnbuckle

Quote I’m thinking about: “Kindness is magic.”

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On why he has decided to return to wrestling:

“When you and I last talked, it was a situation where Vince McMahon, who we openly talk about on our show. Because I think a lot of people with what happened with Vince, it continues to happen with Vince, it’s oh, we can’t talk about it, but we address it. As you know, I’m almost 15 years inside the WWE. My partner, Tommy Carlucci, 32 years inside the WWE. But when I started my sports betting show, Driving The Line, and we left CBS, and as you know, when you started to grind, the first year is just you never feel like you’re getting anywhere. I had somebody come to me and they said, Man, I watched that interview with Van Vliet, and you got so many good stories and so much history with the WWE. Why don’t you embrace it? And I was letting the fact that Vince screwed me over with money get in the way of what my future could be. The media landscape has changed so much now from you know where I live, I don’t have the ability to work for a network right now, I would have to move. I’ve got kids in high school, so you’ve got to look at what your life is and what you can do to earn a living and also set up your future. So when I thought about it, I said, Well, what can we do? Then my buddy Tommy Carlucci, and to tell you how far back me and him go, we call him Big Tommy C. He was the first adult to meet my daughter outside of the hospital, and she’s now 16 years old.” 

So what did Tommy do in WWE? 

“So Tommy was the head of the International TV department, and he worked hand in hand with Shane McMahon for years, his wife still works there. She’s been there 38 years at the company. So, like a lot of people, he was let go a few years ago. And when you’re in your early 60s, and I’m kind of like you, I look at everybody now and say, Man, how can I help? How can I pick people up? How can I be a positive influence? And we’ve been such good friends for a long time. I thought he’s got so many good stories and when he’s not on camera, he’s incredibly entertaining. So I thought, what if we did a show? Originally, I never thought it was gonna go anywhere. I was just like, let’s just have some fun. I had my producer from Driving The Line, let’s just make some shows. And he thought when I called him it was for him to be a producer, not to be on the air. I said, Let’s just try it. And so we tried it, eased him in, and he was a little bit stiff at first, but now, are you kidding me? Conrad calls him all the time for his shows. His storytelling is incredible. We have four or five different shows that we do every single week. We do a live Monday night show called The Last Word, which is kind of chopping up Monday nights. We do live Q & A’s. We do live watch alongs with the PLEs. We have a show called The War Room, where we chop up the five biggest topics. So we’ve developed all of those shows and realized that doing remote content, even though it’s different, and we also have an interview show that obviously you’re going to be a part of too. We’ve done DDP, we were interviewing DDP, and who walks into the interview? Cody Rhodes. We get 30 minutes with Cody Rhodes that we didn’t even plan on. The first thing Cody brought up when we were doing the interview was he goes Coach, I don’t know if you remember, but back when… It kind of hit me, I’ve been underestimating myself when it comes to my role in pro wrestling, my role in the WWE. When you spend 10-plus years, because sometimes these idiots online at home have nothing better to do than to insult you. ‘Oh, you’re an idiot. You got fired…’ I never got fired from WWE. In 2008, I left to go to ESPN. I was the first one to ever do that. How am I listening to this person tell me that after over 10 years, that leaving someplace is a failure, and so when I stopped listening to everybody and just said, what would I enjoy doing? This is what we’ve settled on, and it’s been a really fun ride. We just secured our first big partnership. You and I are together on that. It’s My Bookie. You can bet on who John Cena’s final opponent will be.”

So it’s not gonna be you as John Cena’s final opponent?

“I mean, they haven’t called me yet, and much like a lot of big stars, it had to be the right number. We saw Stone Cold couldn’t work out his deal last year. So I’m a much, much bigger star than Stone Cold, I’m still on the list. I’m a +3500. Undertaker is a +10,000, which makes a lot of sense.”

On who John Cena’s final opponent will be?

“Well, I think it’s gonna be Randy Orton. I really do. Because when you look at the fact that they’re both basically at the same number of World Championships, Randy has come from the kid I knew at 19 years old to where he is now. I’m so incredibly proud of what he’s done and the maturity that he’s had. But Cena, I traveled with him for many, many months, and I know that if you watch whether it was the two hours he sat down with you, whether the interview that he just did with Club Shay Shay, where I thought he was ridiculous for talking about Roman Reigns being the GOAT, but that’s what he believes. And when he believes in something, that’s what he’s going to do. And I believe that he’s got everything mapped out to the opponent for WrestleMania, and when he announced it, because we were doing a live watch along, I thought to myself, so it’s all going to end at WrestleMania, he can’t have another title run, and then what does he do at the press conference?”

On one more title run for John Cena:

“I think he wins at WrestleMania. Because I think, and this may be controversial to say as well, but the way Ric Flair has moved the last couple of years, people love him. I have a great affection for him. He has every so often. I’m going to retire. I’m going to retire. I’m going to retire. He’s now, what, nearly 80 years old, and he’s still out there, you know, Hawking weed and doing all these things. And I just don’t know if, at the end of the day, and this is very petty, if they do this. But I don’t know if the powers that be at WWE want Ric to be that name that’s always at the top of the mountain.” 

On how much Vince McMahon was yelling at the commentators: 

“If you’re saying 1 to 10, it’s usually about a 4. The only time he would yell is if you didn’t say it when he wanted you to say it. So say, for example, Cody Rhodes is coming to the ring. He’d be like, Cody Rhodes big night this Saturday, stuff like that. Now I will say this, you can tell exactly when Vince got pushed out if you listen to Michael Cole, because imagine getting beaten down verbally for 20 years. Michael Cole, I don’t think has missed a show in the 25-plus years he’s been there. I know when I was there for my first 10 years, I missed one, and that was for my honeymoon. That was it. So they create that world in you, and Vince creates that world like this is your show. You got to be here. Can you imagine Jim Nance or Joe Buck? You’re going to work 52 weeks a year. Are you kidding me? So he’s much happier now because Triple H is like, I think after 25 years, if you don’t know how to call it, there’s nothing we can do for you. But yeah, he would be very calm. I do remember a time when I said something he didn’t like about Test, God, rest his soul. I said something to the effect of he was weak, [And Vince said] ‘You’re killing his character. What are you doing? What are you doing? You just killed his character. You killed him. You killed him!’ Oh, my God. Oh my god. And you’re still trying to call the match. The match is still going.” 

On Pat McAfee:

“McAfee is a unicorn, and he says stuff without any fear of repercussion. Michael Cole, the reason you see that reaction from Michael is because if somebody’s gonna get yelled at for something McAfee says, it’s gonna be Michael. So he’s like, oh geez, whether it’s swearing, whether it’s saying something out of bounds, whatever it is. They’re not yelling at McAfee, because they’re like man we love McAfee. We love all the things he does. He does the football, he does the show, he does ESPN. That’s who he is. I mean, last week, for God’s sake, he admitted to drinking 30 Guinness beers, and 18 of them were on camera. He took an edible that was 100 milligrams, admitted to it, and everybody laughed. Every video I saw they go he’s a regular dude, and I’m sitting there going when I was at ESPN, I couldn’t even turn left out of the parking lot if I was supposed to go right, I would get yelled at. Man, it’s so different now. Also, these networks have realized that they can pay guys less, not McAfee, he makes a lot, but pay guys less and allow them to do other things. So if a guy wants to make a million dollars, instead of paying them a million dollars, they could pay them $600,000 and they can go get the $400,000 somewhere else. That was not the case when I was there.”

On selling the Stone Cold Stunner:

“I think I’m top three. I really do. Really do, because people don’t understand how to take it. People go to their knees and take it.” 

Is it Rock number one and Scott Hall number 2?

“Woah, Scott Hall was way over the top. There is a happy medium that you gotta have. If you ask Stone Cold, he would say that I was right up there too. Rock was probably the best. When I started taking it, I learned from watching. By far, and it’s not close, Vince is the worst. Mick Foley is number two, [Linda McMahon’s pretty bad]. That was pretty bad too, yeah, and they never understood all you do is, because when you’re in the ring, and hopefully a lot of young talent listen to this, they think that you’re being watched all the time. You’re not. It’s the person that’s doing whatever it is that they’re doing that’s being watched. So you can fudge it a little bit. What you do is you go down on your feet and you launch yourself. All Stone Cold is doing is putting your head right there and going to his butt. Other people who take it off their knees, they go down. Stone Cold is not coming up with you. So naturally you’re both gonna fall like that. So if you notice Rock, I learned it from Rock. Then you bounce yourself, and then you take the bump and Stone Cold has nothing to do with it, nothing.”

On facing Ric Flair:

“That one happened in Afghanistan, and I’ll never forget they needed an extra match. They said, hey Coach, we need you to go eight minutes with Ric. Ric was so respectful of everybody. I walked up in the locker room and I said, Hey, Ric, they need to add a match, so it’s going to be me and you [Ric said] all right, cool. We’ll just call it out there, figure four. I stopped, there was a couple other talent in the room and they were laughing. I said, Ric no offense, I’m not Shawn Michaels, we can’t just call it out there. I need to know exactly what you are doing. My figure four that I took was so bad they had to edit around it. You never saw it. They started teasing me on the plane ride home, and they called it the figure two. True story.”

On falling off his chair when Kane’s pyro went off:

“Everybody thought that was supposed to happen. It was, I just didn’t know about it. So Vince He loved it when I would get at JR. He loved making fun of JR. And he goes, Hey, I want you to put your feet up on the desk and just lean back and just start talking. And JR would he was so put together, just like Michael Cole is, that he would have things written out for entrances, and he knew exactly when music was gonna hit. And if you threw him off a little bit, he hated that. He would grab me and be like, shut up, shut up. So that one, I was like, fantastic. I’ll be honest, sometimes they wouldn’t put things on the rundown so that talent didn’t know, or it didn’t get leaked to the online community or whatever. That was one of those times. So I just put my feet up, that Pyro is so hot and so loud. It’s probably my funniest moment I’ve ever had. But that’s true. I didn’t know that was coming.” 

On that segment with Viscera:

“Oh God. There have been certain times in my career where I’ve thought to myself, whatever I want to do moving forward, this will stop that. That was one of them, and big Vis what a sweet guy. What’s funny is, you asked me about him and Kane, and those were the two guys that threw me off in the famous SummerSlam commercial, threw me into the pool about five miles from where we’re sitting right now at a $9 million mansion in Hollywood. But having Vis kind of eviscerate me, I guess, in that way. And if people want to know, they can look it up. And I’ve said this many times, there are certain things I should have said no to that is definitely right at the top. It was 2 seconds too long.”

On the Katie Vick storyline:

“I’m telling you right now, and anybody will tell you this, if it was Michael Cole sitting here that if Vince was still involved, people are still terrified of him. I’m not proud of the fact that I never told him no this is one of the things that I’ve told you on and off camera. There’s a lot of things I should have said no to. That was one of the most repulsive, disgusting storylines of all time. During that time, Vince would go down a road and everything he was doing was hitting, whether it was the milk truck, whether it was the cement truck with the Corvette, all of that stuff. So let’s just keep going. Let’s do shock TV. I can tell you this, because they shot that off-site so nobody had seen it until it ran on the show. And backstage, you could hear people just groaning because it was so incredibly bad. And if you put a lie detector on Triple H today, he would probably tell you the same thing.”

On getting screwed over by Vince McMahon:

“I felt like I got screwed over. And then also the five or six months that they put me on Raw and SmackDown, I didn’t like how I was treated and they can say what they want, but that’s that’s the truth. I would actively every week ask Michael Cole, can you talk to Corey about us working together? I have nothing against Corey Graves. I’ve known Michael Cole since 1999, but if they don’t want to work with you, there’s nothing you can do. And Corey never wanted to talk to me. I never had one conversation with Corey Graves, and I tried, and that’s okay, because that’s kind of how the business is. I call it boxing out your pension when you’re at ESPN, if you don’t want somebody to step in and take your spot. And I was never going to take his spot. He’s amazing doing Raw or Smackdown. It was about that’s what Vince wanted. I didn’t come in and go, I’m stepping into that spot. So it was really frustrating, because I felt like I could have really helped. But also now I’m much more vocal about knowing, and this is the other thing is, with the whole ESPN situation because I work for the PGA tour now too, so there’s not too many golf announcers that wear backward hats and sunglasses, but I do it. Because now they just had a tournament with YouTubers. PGA Tour is embracing YouTube. Everything has changed. And so now I realize that back in 2018 maybe that wasn’t the time, but in 2024 there is no more. Oh, he’s a wrestling guy, or he’s a YouTube guy. We’re all in the same bucket, and however you can get views, and however you can get people to watch and listen and be funny, entertaining and also credible, that’s what we’re trying to do. So that’s kind of the lane I’m in.”

What is Jonathan Coachman grateful for:

“The opportunity to do things, to help people and family.”

Bronson Reed (@bronsonishere) is a professional wrestler signed to WWE. He sits down with Chris Van Vliet in Ontario, CA to discuss his return to WWE and his recent rise up the card, hitting Seth Rollins with 6 Tsunamis, his many viral moments with Braun Strowman that also included a fan being thrown and a tsunami on a car, Wade Barrett’s unique call of his finisher, winning the Andre The Giant Memorial Battle Royal during WrestleMania 40 weekend, becoming a dad and more!

Quote I’m thinking about: “Consistency compounds.” – John C. Maxwell

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On being a dad:

“It’s good. We’re very lucky. She sleeps through the night. She’s almost seven months old now. Since she was five months old she slept from seven at night until about 6:30 in the morning. So can’t complain [laughs].  Everyone says that first year is super hard. I get it.”

On returning to WWE:

“I had a lot of faith that when I was released that I would end up back in WWE. I didn’t think it would be so soon. So when I got released, I remember Drew McIntyre messaging me and talking about his experience, and he said it took almost seven years before he got re-signed. He did a lot, obviously, in the UK scene and stuff like that. So I was planning maybe three or four years, maybe I could get a good run in Japan for a couple of years and then be back in WWE. But then it ended up being 16 or 17 months I was gone. Obviously things changed. Hunter was sort of back in charge again, and I was always a Hunter guy in NXT, and he reached out to me and ended up back.”

On his goal when he got released:

“I’ve always had a big passion for Japanese-style wrestling. When I started wrestling, I trained in the Inoki style of wrestling. The guy that trained me actually trained under Inoki, so I always had a big passion for that. And I thought, well, if I can’t do WWE, that’s where I’ll go. Then I ended up fitting really well and then I had a decision to make, whether to stay in Japan and continue to pursue that, or to come back to WWE. And I think for me, I’ve been a lifelong fan of WWE, I didn’t get to do things like be on a Monday Night Raw or be on SmackDown or the PLEs or pay-per-views, what they used to call them, so that sort of was the drawing force to bring me back. I still had a lot of moments, I think I needed to get ticked off.”

On what WWE is seeing in him now that maybe they didn’t before:

“I think Hunter always saw it. Obviously, I don’t think the other higher-ups saw it for whatever reason. I was babyface at the time. I’ve always said I work better as a heel, and I tried to push for that in NXT, and it didn’t happen. They wanted to keep me as babyface, which is fine. Now that I’m back, I’ve been able to be a heel, but I sort of still was on the back burner for the first year or so. I’m one of those guys that is almost like a match guy. I guess you can say you can throw me in there with a cruiserweight at someone like a Ricochet, and I’ll have like, a great match. Or I can go in there with someone like Braun Strowman to have a good match. They always know that they can get a good match out of me. But it’s those extra things that I think have elevated me in the last three months or so, which is attacking people, and all the backstage stuff and just some viral moments, which I’ve always wanted to do.”

On the 6 Tsunamis delivered to Seth Rollins:

“I think it was supposed to be significantly less. Then the way that it turned out with Hunter’s vision, is it just was more and more and more. It was one of those things where you’re listening to the audience, you can just feel a change in the audience, as I was doing it, hit the first two, they’re sort of booing. It looks like that’s it. Then I go out for the third one, people sort of like, what the hell’s going on here? Then I go up for the fourth one, they can’t comprehend what’s happening. And by the fifth one, they’re chanting for more. There’s like blood lust amongst the crowd for someone that they love as well. They love Seth Rollins. I was glad that it actually ended up working where after the sixth one I left, and they still started chanting and singing his music that he comes out to, so that also worked.”

On telling Seth more Tsunamis were coming:

“As it’s happening. So it’s one of those things like, yeah, he has to be willing to be there and I have to be willing to be able to do more. But it had definitely worked out and made for such a great moment in television. I think I had so much buzz around that, and then people online as well saying they haven’t seen something like that in WWE for so long, where you can take someone to just propel them in one night with just one segment. Not a match, nothing else, just that.”

On that being his defining moment:

“I think so for sure. I spoke with Hunter right afterwards and he said that’s a moment that will last forever, they can replay that as much as possible. For me, it’s nowhere near as good, because he’s one of the best ever, but it’s like Stone Cold at King of the Ring doing the 3:16 line, that promo, you instantly remember it, and you instantly remember a switch and his character and where it went from then. I’m hoping that people remember the 6 Tsunamis as something similar.”

On travel issues:

“When I was in NXT, and then when I first returned to WWE I was still in coach, and then I had to do some contract negotiations. Yeah, that’s legitimately the thing. I’m like, I don’t fit. Like, I need first class travel, which I have now. Thank God.”

On if he planned for the Braun Strowman segments to go viral:

“No, I don’t think so. I was excited to be able to work with Braun. I think there was a natural chemistry there, we have maybe touched one time before in the Andre the Giant battle royal last year. And I was like, Oh, we could do something there with me and him. But then it’s like, what do you do? And then Hunter obviously had great vision for things, came up with the car angle and everything. And then once we were filming that, it’s in the moment, I was like, Okay, this is gonna be cool. I think people were gonna really respond to this. And then it ended up being WWE’s most viral moment of the week. I think it got almost 13 million views across social media platforms. So it worked.”

On not being able to practise the segments:

“It’s one of those things. The car’s there and it’s like, if we practice it, we’re going to destroy the car. So it just has to be [there and then] and that’s also, was all one live take as well. Some people thought that maybe we stopped recording that earlier in the day or something, and then did the rest live? And I was like, No, that’s all one continuous thing, everything me and Braun’s done has been live.”

On how matches are different if the opponent is bigger:

“I think pacing is a little different. If it’s two big guys we can’t be running around doing stuff like that. Obviously, everything that we endure, every punch from someone that big is different to a punch from someone smaller, and I think that’s a problem. I’m not calling anyone out, but in our business now, a lot of people will sell things the same for every single person. So they will wrestle someone, say Akira Tozawa, who’s great, but I’m not going to sell for Akira Tozawa the same way I’d sell for Braun Strowman. But there are people in our business now because they’re so used to just to doing whatever the way they sell, yeah, that’s how they sell. And it’s like, no, you need to change your [style], every match should be different.”

On throwing a fan:

“Yeah, he had a Yeet shirt on [laughs]. I mean, I didn’t expect that one to be as viral as it is. That actually got the most views out of everything from that most recent match we did. I thought maybe going through the wall would be more viral, but it was hit with a fan getting thrown. I think because people just aren’t expecting it, again, yeah, you know he’s doing his train thing, and then out of nowhere, you just see some guy coming to screen.”

On the way Wade Barrett calls the Tsunami:

“Since he’s been back, he hasn’t been able to say it, I haven’t hit it since he’s been back. So yeah, he’s patiently waiting. The last two weeks he has been like tsunami? And I’m like, No soon enough.”

Did he tell you he was gonna say it like that?

“No. So I obviously told him what the finisher was back in NXT, and he was like, Yeah, I’m gonna think of a way to say it. And then he just instinctively just went with my motion, I guess, and it’s perfect. His voice, everything, and everyone wants him to say it like there’s nothing against Michael Cole, who is great. Everyone’s great. But everyone wants Wade to say it.”

On his WWE return being somewhat underwhelming:

“I think this sort of happens at times. Obviously, I’d been rehired, they want to use me. They don’t really know what to do with me. So they sort of just rush something, put you in something so you’re at least on TV, and they can start to establish you and stuff. But I think the best way to do things is to make him impactful. I did something similar to what I did with Seth in TNA when I went to Impact Wrestling, I attacked Josh Alexander on my first night. I only gave him three tsunamis. But it was enough to be like, Oh my God, this guy is an instant threat against one of the main guys here in TNA. Like, what’s he going to do? And I think that’s sort of what I should have done in my debut with WWE, but that’s out of my control.”

On there being no follow-up to his Andre The Giant Battle Royal win:

“I feel like people sort of, and hopefully not people within our company, but people sort of not disrespected the trophy, but like, it’s sort of like a throwaway match, and I wanted to win it and make sure that it wasn’t that. I was hoping that I could do more with the trophy, but I’d won it and then I didn’t see it the next week. I don’t know what they did with it but I said I wanted to carry it around for a couple of months and make it like a thing, but that didn’t happen. Andre the Giant is such a pivotal figure in wrestling, he became bigger than wrestling. You could go to Australia, where I’m from, and mention Andre the Giant in the 80s and people would know who he was, he was a worldwide name. So I feel like they need to sort of make that more of a thing than what it is.”

On his Mount Rushmore of wrestling:

“My top two of all time, Kenta Kobashi from Japan and Stone Cold Steve Austin, they’re always on there. Then the other two sort of fluctuate, but usually a third is Dusty Rhodes. I just was a huge fan of Dusty Rhodes. I feel like he could do everything, wrestle promo, everything. He also was another big guy that, yeah, people don’t realize, like he was 300 pounds and he was moving around in there, like, yeah.”

On the biggest thing he has learned from Paul Heyman:

“I think it’s how to present myself in the ring. I’ve always wrestled a certain way and for a big man, but there’s even more I can do with my size and to make myself look different. He’s always looking for something that’s different, that and just his promo work is ridiculous. I’ll go to him about a promo, and he’ll just cut a promo off of his head, and it’s like, the best promo I’ve ever heard.”

What is Bronson Reed grateful for?

“My daughter, my wife and wrestling fans.”

Eric Young (@TheEricYoung) is a professional wrestler currently signed to TNA Wrestling. He sits down with Chris Van Vliet at West Coast Creative Studio in Hollywood to discuss his time in TNA and winning the World Championship twice, trying out for WWE early in his career and not getting signed, being part of Team Canada, his role as a comedy wrestler, signing with WWE and his work in Sanity, getting called up without the rest of the group and what went wrong on the main roster, returning to WWE for a second time and nearly being aligned with Bray Wyatt, why he thinks he will retire in TNA, a scary incident where it looked like he might lose his ear and more!

Quote I’m thinking about:

“People quit when things get hard because the thought of something being hard forever is unbearable. But nothing hard last forever. You either quit, it gets easier or you get harder. No matter what, it always ends. But you only lose when you quit before you see it through.” – Alex Hormozi

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On there being so many talented wrestlers from Canada:

“I don’t know, there’s something in the water in Canada. Seriously, we just make really good professional wrestlers. Ronnie, Shawn Spears, Tye Dillinger, or whatever aliases you want to call him. He was one of those guys that was better than me the first day he was there, you could show him something, and he could do it almost instantly. Full circle, fast forward. We end up wrestling each other in NXT. He worked in the WWE before I did. It’s like he’s my son, my pro wrestling son, and he did it. He did it faster than I did, and he’s one of the best guys ever, and crazy talented.”

On the challenges of working in the United States as a non-citizen:

“Well, it’s hard. We’ve chit chatted about this on the way over here today is American people, or American wrestlers or people in entertainment in general don’t understand the extra added level of difficulty. Because coming here and working here without a visa or without being married or without something is illegal, completely illegal. So it makes it so much more difficult than anyone realizes. Me and Bobby Roode were very close to being hired by the WWE probably around 2001. We had done, who knows, 20-25 dark matches and try out things. They were interested, but it came down to they were going to hire us, we came up in a meeting and they’re like, oh well, they’re Canadian. Then it was like oh well, who else could we [use]? I don’t know who the two other guys that they hired were, but it was basically because we were Canadian, they didn’t end up signing us. So yeah, it just adds this really, really difficult layer that most people aren’t aware of.”

Thinking at one point that it might never happen:

“The truth was even TNA in 2003 didn’t even really seem like [an option], I didn’t know what anyone was making, but I didn’t think that it would be a place where I could work and make a living full time. They’re doing the weekly pay-per-view on Wednesday nights. I think the pay-per-view cost $9.99, they got Shamrock and all these other people like that. There’s no money left there for me or for guys like me. But then started getting [interest], went down and met some people there, and then got booked on one of the pay-per-views and did like a tryout match. And so there was interested in both places at the same time, and I was just trying to keep as many of my options open as I could, because I wanted to do it full time for a living.”

On trying to work in the USA as he is Canadian:

“I mean, it’s a wild story, and I don’t know if I’ve ever said this in an interview, to be honest. So I’m going to Nashville, and I’m doing independent shows, and I had been backstage at TNA a couple times, then I got booked on one of the shows, and it was like a six man tag, and I can’t remember who it was. I want to say they’re doing the getting ready to do the World X Cup, but I wasn’t on Team Canada. Team Canada hadn’t been formed yet, and it was me Elix Skipper and Shark Boy were Team USA, which is hilarious. I was wrestling against, I want to say it was Hector Garza, Abismo Negro and Heavy Metal from Team Mexico, but I’m really bad at remembering those things, but I think that’s what it was. So the first time I appeared, I was on Team USA, that’s the very first time I ever appeared, and just kind of as a throwaway thing, but I had met one of the girls. They had like cage dancers, and if you remember they had girls in bikinis dancing in between the matches and sometimes during the entrances. I met her, and we became friends and started hanging out and kind of dating, that went on for a couple months, and I’m wrestling for the WWE and getting across the border, sneaking across the border, basically illegally. I don’t even know if I can get in trouble for saying that now, but either way.”

On his early views of TNA:

“That it wasn’t gonna survive. I can remember thinking that when I was 21 to 22 years old. Because they’re just doing the pay-per-views at this point and there’s big name guys on there that are not cheap. There are big ticket guys that are making probably very good money, and they’re not going to appear on it unless they’re making good money. Because those are the rules. So it’s not like they’re Oh, Jeff’s a friend of mine, so I’m doing him a favor. There was a lot of money being spent, not enough money coming in, and then they get the deal with Dixie Carter coming in and taking it over basically as the CEO. Then the Fox Sports thing starts to happen. So now we’re shooting pay-per-views on Wednesday nights in Nashville, and then we were out all night. It’s five, we’ve got to go to the airport, get in a car, somehow get to the airport, fly on a Southwest flight. There’d be 40 of us on the plane. Fly to Orlando, land, take a bus to Universal Studios and shoot the Fox Sports Show there in in Orlando. At the time, there was very little wrestling in Orlando. So I can remember the Team Canada versus Sonjay Dutt, Chris Sabin, and it might have been Shark Boy. It was me, Bobby and Petey in a six man tag, and Sonjay Dutt gave me like a hip toss, I took a bump, and the place just came unglued for a hip toss. I remember looking at Bobby Roode after the match and saying, Man, I hope we can do all the shows here, and we got what we wished for. Then you’re taking bumps on ladders eight years later, and there’s 45 people there, and nobody cares.” 

On TNA being an alternative to WWE:

“I think they did a really good job of making it completely different, trying not to do what they were doing. Because competing with them is stupidity. As Ted Turner found out, there is no competing with them. They were the New York Yankees and we were the Mississippi Mud Ends, and that’s okay. We’re still playing the same sports, still the same thing, still the same risks, still the same rewards. And then over time, it built into this very legitimate alternative.” 

On if the six sided ring was going to come back as part of the TNA brand:

“I’m sure they exist somewhere. But then there’s this whole other thing cost to now, you have to have a truck, and this truck has to drive all over the United States hauling the six sided ring run when we go to towns we’re using rings that are in and around the area, and then they dressed it up to make it look like the TNA ring. The TNA ring looks like the TNA ring. The ring is never the same ring. It’s a different ring in every city that we’re in. So there’s this whole other cost of having this because the six-sided ring, the only place that happened was TNA, and they at that point, it was big enough where they had a truck, a ring truck, and it drove from city to city to where we went. So we would have the truck, but, or we’d have the six-sided ring, but I don’t think that’s viable for where TNA is now. The truth is I don’t know if the six sided rings even exist. That’s why they’d have to have them built.”

On who moved the needle the most in TNA:

“I mean, the biggest for me personally is Christian, he came by choice. Kurt had been released, and him coming probably is an even bigger deal numbers-wise visually, but I think as a wrestler and as knowing the full story of both sides, Christian turned down a deal there to come because he felt he had a lot more to prove in the ring. He wanted to be the guy, and he’s one of the best professional wrestlers ever. I would challenge anybody that, as a person that’s done it at a very high level for a long time, a guy that shared a ring with him, he’s just one of the best he’s one of the best minds for it. Just overall, his body of work is actually incredible. Him betting on himself to come there, making that a thing for other guys, you know, I think partially making that a thing for Kurt and for later on, for Booker T and Rob Van Dam and these other guys that whether they were under contract or not. They realized when they left the other place, wherever they were, it was an option for them to continue to be on TV, to keep their name in the wrestling world. So, yeah, to me, Christian is the biggest because it was by choice, not by necessity. That’s no slight on Kurt or any of the other guys. I’ve had to necessarily move to another place too, that’s just business. But I think, to me, the biggest is Christian because he chose.”

On when was prime TNA:

“I want to say it’s right in that wheelhouse of probably 2008 to 2012, that’s when it’s really rolling. We’re doing house shows every weekend. We’re going to the UK and doing really good numbers. I can’t remember [the network], it was on the free channel. So TNA in the United Kingdom is massive. At one point, it was outrating the WWE, because WWE is on a pay channel, so you had to have like an HBO Style channel to watch the WWE. But if you were a wrestling fan. TNA was available to you for free and on any TV in the United Kingdom. Will Ospreay talks about it, AJ Styles and X Division, that’s what made Will Ospreay want to be a wrestler. He’s a TNA fan. That’s what made him want to get into pro wrestling. And at that time, we were doing really good numbers. There are huge houses there. We’re wrestling all over North America, house shows on Friday, Saturday, and Sunday, and live TV is doing well on Spike. It’s rating actual, you know, big names are coming over. They’re in the mix. There’s a bunch of homegrown talent like AJ and Joe and Bobby and I’m in there. I’m not at that level yet, but I’m very involved in what’s going on. So a very exciting time to be part of it.” 

On winning the TNA World Championship:

“For sure it’s vindicating. I have said this before and I mean it, if you in the professional wrestling business and you don’t want to be the World Champion, then you’re either lying or you’re in it for the wrong reasons. And in the end, it’s a prop, I didn’t win anything. Someone said, We want you to carry it, but with that responsibility, that’s the drug of this multi-million dollar company that’s airing these shows that millions of people are watching. We’re saying you’re the most important piece, and we believe that you can carry interest or hold the fort while we’re transitioning to something else, that level of responsibility is something that I’ve always wanted, and I’ve known kind of deep in my heart I’ve always been good enough, but actually getting it, being able to have that feather in your cap is very vindicating.”

On winning the World Championship a second time:

“Well the first, you never forget your first. At that point, I mean, the second one was strange, because during COVID, right? So there’s no fans in the arena, which is very wild. And at that point I had done lots of other things, and my name was big. It wasn’t a stretch for me to win that world title the second time. I think it was a bit of a stretch the first time. I think there were a lot of people who were resistant to it, and that’s okay, I’m not embarrassed by that at all. But yeah, the first one was huge, and my mom was still alive, and she was staying at my house, and I didn’t even really know I was winning it kind of until I got down to Orlando. I think I was shooting the end, or maybe the start of the second season of Off Your Hook. So I flew home, and I had the belt in my bag, and she didn’t know, and I got a really cool picture of her holding it, very special.”

On leaving TNA for WWE:

“I think at the time I had kind of done everything, there wasn’t a ton left for me there to accomplish. I’d been the World Champion, Tag Champion, TV champion, Global Champion, Knockouts Tag, me and ODB never lost those belts, just so everyone knows. So technically, we’re still the champs. They took them from us. But yeah, obviously I’d always wanted to wrestle in the WWE, that’s my dream. The opportunity came around, and TNA’s people were kind enough to let me kind of finish up my deal there and move on to a different opportunity. And, yeah, I mean, had a meeting with Hunter and it went well, and the rest is kind of history. So it was like fulfilling a lifelong dream was part of it. Also, it was kind of I think time for me to move past that. At the time TNA was certainly declining. We had moved from network to network to network, it was shrinking and I knew it was kind of a matter of time before bigger opportunities were just going to kind of go away because of circumstances that the company found itself in at the time, and obviously, WWE is not going anywhere. NXT at the time is the hottest brand in pro wrestling. Anyone that says it wasn’t wasn’t watching or wasn’t paying attention. It was white hot. Guys like Shinsuke and Bobby Roode and Adam Cole and FTR, they made it into this viable [brand], it wasn’t an option, it was the number one thing driving the WWE. The other shows were obviously bigger and doing bigger numbers. But the tickets that sold first were TakeOver. They go into a place. They go into New York on WrestleMania weekend. TakeOver Saturday night sold before anything else, they were sold out instantly. It was the hottest brand in pro wrestling, and to be part of that was a massive honor for me and at that point in my career, very exciting.”

On getting called up without a plan and without Sanity:

“Well, the plan was it was the three of us and not Nikki. We didn’t like that, because she was such an important part of what the group was. The first time you see me, it’s me by myself. But that’s because our debut was supposed to happen on SmackDown. We were supposed to come our music was going to hit, we come out of the end of SmackDown, we’re going to do and we’re going to do this thing with New Day. I’m pumped. They’re three amazingly talented guys, they’re crazy over, Austin [Creed] is still a very good buddy of mine. I knew Kofi a little bit and Big E a little bit, but just being around him those few couple weeks, they’re just good people. I know it’s going to be amazing to work with them. The six man tag that was in the ring. I want to say it was Miz, Joe and someone versus New Day, and it went long, it’s live TV, and it went long, and our entrance got cut. The end of SmackDown is supposed to be us standing at the top of the ramp and our music playing. It goes black. That’s huge. But instead, it’s the end. The match, ding, ding, ding, SmackDown is over because they ran out of time and just a victim of circumstance, all this weird stuff happens.

I’m standing there in my Sanity gear ready. We’re literally standing in front of the curtain, waiting for them to count us down and say go. Then they’re like, No, we’re cutting it. And it’s heartbreaking. But at point that point Sanity is such a hot group that they’ll figure it out. Something else will come along, no big deal. I think it was maybe a week or two later, we’re in a thing with The Usos. We wore black tracksuits during one of the breaks, and they hide us into the ring, we come out from underneath the ring, we beat them up and get really good heat. Sanity was like number two trending in the world that night. Half of the audience doesn’t know who we are, because they just are people that watch SmackDown and Raw. They don’t really watch NXT but it was still a popular enough group that we made a pretty good impact. The Usos are awesome. I’m pumped to work with both of them. Then I think SmackDown is at in Ontario, here in California, and Shinsuke gets attacked by one of the bomb-sniffing dogs during the day. He’s in the changing room, and this professionally trained dog, they are going around looking for explosives, and it just attacks him, bites his leg, he has to go to the hospital. So it’s supposed to be Shinsuke versus Jeff Hardy. Jeff Hardy’s the Intercontinental Champion that night. And they’re like, Well someone’s got to wrestle Jeff. I think it was Brian James said thinking he’s doing me a favor. We’re still buddies, he’s a very good friend of mine. He says Eric Young’s great, he could do it well, not fully thinking that through, that means the first time you see Eric Young on television he’s going to get beat. Winning and losing has never been super important to me, but there’s times when you need to win and times when you need to lose, and when you’re first debuting, they’re breaking my legs before I can run. Right there I’m getting beat, and there’s no shame, I’ll lose to Jeff Hardy every night, one of the most over wrestlers of all time, yeah, but it was kind of the beginning of the end right away, before we even got started.”

On confronting “the person in charge”:

“I don’t really know what happened. Nobody can tell me, the person in charge, we all know who that is, not allowed to say the name, just kind of didn’t like it. Although it was his choice to bring us up in the first place. But at that point, like this is what would happen. There’s just no rhyme or reason to any of it, and just a victim of circumstance. The fans liked us, the boys liked us, the internet was a buzz about Sanity coming up. Everyone liked us. The unfortunate truth is there’s one person that didn’t get it and he’s the only person that mattered. I talked to him like I talked to anybody. I interrupted [him], and I was told to do it by people there, and I went and interrupted a meeting he was in. We had a very good conversation, and he said, Do you have ideas? I said, Yep, sure do. Came in the next week, pitched ideas. He was very open and very complimentary. Thank you for bringing this in, and thank you for showing initiative. And then they sent Damo and Wolfe back to NXT, and then I got sent over to Raw and it got worse. I mean, I didn’t do anything. I didn’t make him mad. I didn’t have a bad match, there’s nothing I did. He just decided that I was no good at whatever I was that I was doing, I wasn’t doing anything. I don’t know how you came to that decision, and I’ve said this before too, I’m not the first person that he’s missed out on. Won’t be the last, right? Well, hopefully I’m one of the last. But Kenny Omega was there and didn’t last eight months, so the one of the best bell-to-bell ever in the universe, and he couldn’t survive. So it’s frustrating more than anything. I’m not mad about it. I moved on, for sure, with my life and very fulfilled, very happy person. I’m exactly where I’m supposed to be. But it’s a very disappointing thing, yeah, very disappointing.” 

On his WWE release:

“I was making very good money and wasn’t going to work, I would have fired me. I was well aware it was coming. I didn’t think the group would be that big. There’s guys that were working on TV like Rusev and a bunch of people. It was a bloodletting, and I was definitely in that group. I can’t remember, someone put the numbers up, I want to say it was like 125 different guys, or whatever it was, a lot all at once. So, like I said, I’m not traveling down to Orlando where they’re shooting the COVID-restricted tapings. I’m not talking to anybody. I’m well aware that it’s coming. I’m kind of hoping that I’ll sneak under the radar somewhere, somehow, and continue on. But that’s not what happened. Got released during that and Scott D’Amore, who I’ve been friends with for 30 years, is one of the first people to call me and apologize and say he’s really sorry that happened. But in a week [he said] let me crunch some numbers and figure some stuff out. Let’s talk. I really want you to be in to come to TNA. So that was surely a relief at that point, because at point that point I’ve got 90 days, and I’m going to be unemployed and maybe making $0.”

On briefly returning to WWE:

“So I was employed by them for, I think eight or nine months. [People don’t know this because you weren’t on TV.] Yeah, some people know, but I think the majority of the world doesn’t. They don’t understand, because I would never show up at TV. The truth is, I never left my house. So yeah, I was proposed a gimmick to work there with two guys, and was super excited about it. Then that didn’t happen, and one of them was Bray, and then Bray passed away, which sucked, and is unfair in every way possible. So then it’s like, well pitch some new ideas, and then the person I worked for before forced his way back in. I just kind of said, there’s a lot of reasons why I didn’t want to work there at that point, but the number one reason was I just don’t want to work for a person like that. And this is long before all the other stuff would come out. But I was pretty convinced I knew who he was and how he was professionally one, but more importantly, for me, morally, I just can’t work for a human being like that. So I asked for my release, and was granted it. And I’m not saying any of the stuff, because I had to sign an NDA. So yeah, it’s a whole weird thing.” 

Were you going to be in an early iteration of The Wyatt Sicks?

“I think the original idea was me, Bray and Bo as a trio. That’s what was told to me from Hunter, basically. So obviously I’m gonna jump at that. I’m friends with both of those guys. It would have been creatively just an unbelievable opportunity working there, working on the main roster wrestling all over the world with two guys that I get along with well, and obviously a huge part of the show at that point. The Fiend and Bray coming back was one of the most popular things at that time, one of the most viewed things. They put up those viral videos, they’d be viewed within six hours by millions of people. So being part of that was very appetizing. It’s kind of not in my wheelhouse, but close enough to my wheelhouse where I would have really enjoyed it, it would have been challenging, but in a really cool way. So I was obviously very excited, and then all the stuff happened with the sale and all this other weird stuff. All of a sudden, I wasn’t working for the person who hired me, and I wasn’t willing to do that. I don’t regret it, not at all. I think it’s the coolest. It’s not lost in me that I was able to walk away from money like that, stability like that, because of what I believe, beliefs of the kind of human being that I am. 10 years ago, I don’t know if I would have been able to make that choice financially or personally or certainly not professionally. I’m in a position where I’ll be fine. I’ll figure it out. I hadn’t even talked to Scott at the time, or TNA, we had zero conversations about it. I just knew I wasn’t going to work for the WWE anymore. So it’s a wild one, but the truth is it was 100% my choice. I think there’ll be a lot of people that think that’s stupid, a lot of people that won’t make that choice. But I think for me in my career, I think it’s one of the proudest things I’ve ever done.”

On his ear nearly falling off:

“I’m not great on social media, but there was all this stuff, it had to be reattached and all this stuff. It was obviously very serious. I had a huge cut on the back of my ear from a table spot I did with Frankie. And totally my fault. I’m doing the Spanish Fly. I know when he does it, he kind of goes sideways a bit, kind of turns to one side. In my head he went this way, but he actually doesn’t. He goes this way, and I’m going this way, and he’s going that way, and ended up busting the table with my head. I mean, really, I probably should be dead. As soon as I hit, you can just see the blood just stream down. So the internet does what the internet does, and [says] his ear got ripped off. Man, that sounds awesome, that sounds cool. I’m not going to correct them. I’m just going to let them say whatever they want, because the truth is whatever they say is always going to be cooler than the truth. That’s the rule. I’m never going to let truth get in the way of a good story. The story wasn’t I had to have my ear reattached. I think it was eight stitches behind my ear, but it was just bleeding nonstop because of where it was.”

What is Eric Young grateful for?

“The industry of pro wrestling, my friends and family and opportunity.”

Trick Williams (@_trickwilliams) is a professional wrestler currently signed to WWE. He sits down with Chris Van Vliet at the WWE Performance Center in Orlando, Florida to discuss his meteoric rise to the top of NXT, giving up on his first dream of playing in the NFL, winning the NXT Championship and the response from the fans that made the cameras shake, the first time he heard ‘Whoop That Trick’, Booker T’s ad-libs to his entrance song, his diss track on Pete Dunn and more!

Quote I’m thinking about: “No amount of regret changes the past. No amount of anxiety changes the future. But any amount of gratitude changes the present.”

Complete this survey for your chance to win $500: https://bluewirepods.com/survey

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PURE PLANK: The future of core fitness! Use the code CVV to save 10% on Pure Plank which was designed by Adam Copeland & Christian: https://gopureplank.com/

PLUNGE: Get $150 off your Plunge with the coupon code CVV150 at http://plunge.com

On his NXT rise:

“I’m enjoying all of this, it’s cloud 9. This is why I wanted to do this, to feel the rush that I get from the fans, to win the titles and make a difference. Seeing the kids go crazy is awesome.”

On the start of his fandom:

“To be honest with you, I opened a can of whoop ass at three years old. First cuss word. So Stone Cold was probably my first favorite, at least that’s what my people tell me. Then, of course, that whole Attitude Era, Stone Cold, The Rock, Shawn Michaels, Triple H, Booker T, that’s when I really fell in love with wrestling. But of course my pops, he actually played football. So I took that route. I played football my whole life, from probably 4 years old to 24-25 and then made it to Philadelphia Eagles, got cut and then didn’t know what I was going to do with my life honestly, because up to that point, only saw myself being a football player. I had an agent at the time. He said, Yeah, we’re gonna get you to another campus no problem. Nothing happened. Then he said he’s gonna send my film to the XFL, which was owned by somebody who was connected with WWE at the time. Next day, I got an email from WWE, Hey, if you’re interested, we’d love to have you in for a tryout. Up to that point, of course I knew what WWE was, I watched it for a long time, but I never once thought about what it took to actually become a WWE Superstar. So I looked at like, Yo, this is crazy. My pa said man, you better do it. You ain’t making no money on the couch. So I went to the tryout man, and I loved it, like the whole idea of promos, being an athlete, I felt like I was right at home. But they didn’t sign me. They said, Look, you got a good look, you’re charismatic, but you have never wrestled before. So go learn how to wrestle, and maybe we bring you back for another tryout. I went back to Philly, went to CZW, trained there, had my first match, had a character named Sweet Daddy Trick. And I just say I’ve come a long way since then. But, yeah, that’s where I started.”

On giving up on his first dream of playing in the NFL:

“It was [difficult] because it was foreign to me. For 20 years playing football, I learned how to stay on my feet and be an athlete. My first day of training to be a WWE superstar I learn how to fall and hit the ground, it was just foreign to me. But the crazy thing is, it’s funny, like football, I love football. I played for a very long time. I played at a high level, but I felt like I was working extremely hard for the amount of hours I was putting in to be good at the game and received the attention and the notoriety I wanted from the game. It wasn’t feeding me back. You ever loved the girl but she never really loved you back? That was football for me, and I was good at it. But with wrestling, I feel at home.”

On receiving a second WWE try-out:

“I’m blessed. I think actions speak louder than words. They asked me to go take that step and take a chance on myself. I’m not sure how many people who aren’t familiar with the craft would be willing to do that. Now we have the whole NIL deal and everything like that, and athletes, they almost come into it expecting to be on the roster and have a chance. But that’s why I have mad respect for everybody who comes from the indies, because they truly know the craft they put the time in. They are driving from city to city, they’re working for nothing. They’re working for 20 bucks, they’re hoping to get booked. I feel like the bridge, I see it from both sides now, because I had to do both sides. Yeah, I’m an athlete new to the world, and I wasn’t spending a bunch of time on the indies, but I learned to appreciate how good of a vehicle this WWE is, and I can’t take this for granted.”

On winning the NXT Championship:

“Unreal. Shout out to Ilja Dragunov, who I would say really took my career to the next level, especially at that time, all three to four of our matches showed people that I had that next level in me. The day I did take the title from Ilja Dragunov, it was a beautiful moment. I’m not sure if you saw but the whole arena was shaking from the Whoop That Trick chants, people stomping, people screaming, people crying. It was unreal, man, and the emotion that I felt in that ring at that time, it’s gonna be hard to duplicate, because it was just 100% everybody was behind, and that’s a special moment. Man, that’s why I wanted to do this.” 

On the first time he heard Whoop That Trick:

“I was actually rocking with Melo at the time, and used to come out to his music and people chanting, Whoop That Trick. Whoop That Trick. I didn’t know exactly what that meant, we were heels at the time. And I was like, Are they with I looked at Melo. I said, Yo, are they with us or are they against us? I don’t know. I hit a move or something, got a body slam, and whoop that trick. I said, Okay, I think they like this. Then those Whoop that trick chants, it was started by the crowd. It just continued to grow and grow and grow. It was totally organic, but I think it really took off when they changed my entrance music. This is something else, I’m not sure if people know, but I went to the production team and said Hey, I would like to change my music. I want to go with family ties. Kendrick Lamar, I want heavy horns in the beginning. I need, 808 drums and heavy bass. They came back to me with this instrumental that I have now, I thought, yeah, that’s the one.”

Was there an intention to get the fans to chant Whoop That Trick:

“Never. It was a beautiful, organic moment. I believe it was Heatwave against Ilja Dragunov if I’m not mistaken. I came out. It was a heated feud. And when the beat dropped, the people’s right there on beat with it, whoop that trick. And if you look at my face a little bit, you see a little smirk. Oh, shoot, we just started something, and then we went out there had a banger match. I think that’s the day whoop that trick went to a whole nother level and shout out to the NXT crowd, man, there’s nothing like them.”

On that entrance in the Royal Rumble:

“Oh man. I think we all want that!”

On Ethan Page:

“He stole the title, he conned his way into WWE. He conned his way into the title picture. He conned the title of me. He ain’t gonna con his way into CW, enough is enough.”

On NXT going to the CW:

“We are about to bring the best two-hour show to CW. I mean, I put our show against anybody’s. NXT is on fire right now, and shout out to Shawn Michaels. We just clicking on all cylinders and we’re ready to put on the show, man. I’m glad about the CW, we are in every single household now. That means everybody gets to see us do our thing.”

On Shawn Michaels comparing Trick Williams to Scott Hall:

“That’s awesome. Yeah, he’s one of my favorites to be honest with you. But yeah, I guess I just feel like I have so much to offer as far as athleticism. In football I played wide receiver, it’s kind of similar, I was a big wide receiver. Wide receivers are usually the most athletic guys on the field. So I’ve been training like that my whole life. So it’s cool, it’s nothing to run, jump, fly, but heights, I just stay away from the heights.”

On Carmelo Hayes:

“I’m happy for Melo. You know, we had our odds about the whole situation, but I feel like sometimes, man, you got two alpha males, two guys who want to be the greatest, two guys who want to be the face of a brand, like, what you expect to happen? You know, we saw this happen with Easy E and Ice Cube.”

On a possible main roster call-up soon:

“I think about it all the time, but I’m happy where my feet are. I mean, NXT is on fire right now, arguably one of the better times NXT has ever seen. So with that, I’m proud to be here. I’m proud to be the face of NXT. Why are we going to CW? Why we got the biggest TV deal NXT has ever gotten, why we’re doing this traveling and stuff now. I’m part of it, and it feels good to say, hey, we party something special here.”

On Booker T:

“He’s another guy who’s been just so helpful to me. We see the ad libs and everything he does with the entrance, but behind the scenes we break down film. He says, See that step right there? Get rid of that. We are talking about skill and why I’m getting better. It’s people like Booker T’s, people like Shawn Michaels, people like Matt Bloom and, of course, Terry Taylor, who I train with every day. But these guys definitely.”

On a future dream match:

“I mean, he’s the top guy in the business right now. I mean, shout out to Cody Rhodes, who is amazing. I’m glad that he finished and started his new story. But Roman, he’s the guy who’s been the cornerstone of the business for a while now. So if you don’t want to match with him, then you don’t really want to be here.”

What is Trick Williams grateful for?

“Health, strength, family, friends, and that I get to do this.”

Shawn Spears (@ShawnSpears) is a professional wrestler currently signed to WWE. He sits down with Chris Van Vliet in Orlando, Florida to talk about his return to WWE and why he didn’t come back as Tye Dillinger, why he left AEW, why he didn’t return at the 2024 Royal Rumble, being previously known as Stan and being superkicked by Shawn Michaels at Cyber Sunday 2006, the accidental chair shot on Cody Rhodes that led to his nickname of “The Chairman”, how being a dad has changed things, his wife Cassie Lee and if she intends to come back to wrestling and more.

Quote I’m thinking about: “When everything seems to be going against you, remember that the airplane takes off against the wind, not with it.” ―Henry Ford

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On balancing work and family life:

“Time-wise, and a lot of it is on me, because I still have Flat Backs with Breeze, so we still run that on a weekly basis. The schedule can be difficult, but that’s why Cass is a trooper. She holds down the fort. We do have a nanny who’s wonderful and Austin is head over heels in love with her and her him. We have a good team around us that helps maximize the time that we do get together and things like that. So it does get pretty hectic, but it’s for the short term. I’d rather do this and grind it out now, while they’re young, and while they don’t understand when I start leaving, and he recognizes when I leave, and he starts crying at the door, that’s when I’m going to have to kind of start adjusting schedules and times a little bit.”

On how being a dad has changed him:

“So I think we were kind of talking about this, it makes me watch my mouth a little bit more. It makes me a little more cautious about what I’m watching on TV, a little bit more. A lot of times, being busy and things like that. You know, a lot of us that are on the move, or a lot of us that have excess things going on, like other businesses or properties or other things like that, I’m on my phone a lot. I do a lot of that through that. So I have to be a little more aware that when he’s in the room and he says, Dad, I can hear him. I’m not lost in something else, my attention has to be divided at the right times. So it’s made me a lot more self aware. I’ve definitely in an industry where you kind of have to put yourself first for a extended period of time in order to get to certain heights, I’ve been easily and very happily able to put myself second, third and fourth, if need be, without any second thought. So, yeah, it changes you in different ways. I have known you for a long time. You’re a good human being. It doesn’t change your perspective on how you operate in life, or anything like that. It might make you more aware now, because you have someone watching you at all times.” 

On coming back to WWE as Shawn Spears:

“It means a good deal to me. Not to take anything away from the Tye Dillinger thing, only because, the way I got the name Tye Dillinger was pretty special to me, so that it holds a special place in my heart. I don’t know if I’ve ever explained this. Dillinger I kind of came up with on my own, based on John Dillinger, the famous bank robber from back in the day, just public enemy number one, but loved by the public and that kind of stuff. So I always have a fascination with things like that. Then Dusty Rhodes was one who gave me the name Tye so that name will always kind of carry a special weight to it. But being away and going back to a name that I picked from a baby book way back when I was first starting out, and being able to kind of put some weight behind it a little bit in terms of what I was able to do with that over the course of X amount of years. When I came back to WWE, it was presented as an option, which I’ve felt very, very grateful for. It was a conversation. It was like, how would you like to proceed? Would you want to go back here, or do you want to kind of hang on to this? And I just said, Let’s hang on to this. Let’s see what we can do. Coming back, a fresh start, fresh slate. Let’s see what we can do. So it meant a lot that I had that had the option. And, yeah, we’re still building, baby, still building.”

On keeping his debut a secret:

“You have the team around you, you know who the team is and you keep your mouth shut. That’s the only way to keep a secret nowadays. Keep your mouth shut. Just don’t tell anybody. I think maybe I knew, Matt Bloom, Shawn Michaels and Triple H, that was it.” 

On his return and the 10 chants:

“They could still work. They can still work today. I love it because it just tells me that at some point in my career, I did something that was able to allow people to connect with each other, [the audience remembers you] That’s a big thing. I mean, that’s the thing about wrestling fans, man, they’re so loyal. They could hate me one week and love me the next week, and then that just goes back and forth. But at the end of the day, we’ve had this conversation before. They’re so loyal. They’re the most loyal fan base on this planet, in my opinion. I think Bret Hart just came back last week in Calgary, stuff like that. But I think he said his famous line, the best there is.. and that the second he said The best everybody is already echoing, they remember. If you’re in this industry for an extended period of time, there’s nothing more gratifying than remembering you.”

On why he left AEW:

“I think it just came down to a personal want, in terms of wanting to contribute a little bit more, both in front of the camera and behind the camera. I had a wonderful time in AEW. I have and have had a great relationship with Tony Khan. You’re never going to hear me say anything bad about that guy. Same thing with a lot of EVPs, talent, everything. I had a wonderful time. I got to learn a lot about myself as a businessman, a lot more of what not to do, and a little bit more so of it’s okay to kind of put your foot down. It’s okay to kind of have faith in what you’re worth and faith in your ability and things like that. So it was a really good learning process in terms of being an individual man in different company. But man, my time there was special, getting to work with all the top guys based on a lot of storylines that I was in with Max and FTR and things like that. So a lot of things that I would have never gotten to do, I think in my career, I was very fortunate enough to do there.”

On if leaving AEW on his own terms was similar to leaving WWE on his own terms in 2019:

“Yes, it was. I asked it on both occasions. It just felt like my time at those different time periods of my life. I had maximized my time in those certain situations. So I thought it was time for me to leave in 2019, I needed to grow as a performer and as a human being. I got to do that for five years with AEW and again, I always kind of go with inklings, like these internal gut feelings. Everybody always says follow your gut. Sometimes what I have learned for me personally is that I have confused those actual gut feelings with what I think is a gut feeling. So I made a lot of wrong decisions in my younger career, whatnot, or younger life. As time has gone on, through learning, through ups and downs and bad calls, I’ve actually been able to go, oh no, that’s not the right feeling. I remember what that’s like. This actually feels like the right call. So luckily, I’ve been able to make the right calls career-wise. But that is heavily based on the relationships that I’ve created throughout those years. No one gets anything done by themselves. Everybody needs kind of a helping hand, so to speak. Professionalism takes precedence. It will carry you further than you could possibly imagine. So that’s what I tell a lot of young talents today. But leaving both companies at different time frames was a personal base decision, and it was one that was best selfishly for me at the time.”

On returning to WWE:

“I immediately reached out to Hunter and just said, I am paraphrasing. I can’t remember exactly what I said, just I’m free if there’s interest the ball’s in your court kind of thing. He just says, What do you want to do? I said, I want to contribute. And he said, Okay, let me see what can happen. Then not long after that, I was in touch and when this presented itself, the chance to come back here, I thought hold on a second. So you’re telling me, I get to go back to a time frame, that was one of my favorites in my career. I get to be around a lot of the coaches that help kind of build me up to this point and I get to be under Shawn Michaels. I get to understand how he thinks, I get to work and see how he operates. And then I get to kind of pass that knowledge down to kids, and I get to pass that on to students at Flat Backs, and I get to be in my bed every night, like, yeah, let’s go. Let’s do this. So it was kind of a no brainer. I jumped all over it.” 

On being Stan and being kicked by Shawn Michaels:

“So when they pulled me aside for that, Cyber Sunday 2006. I just gotten down to OVW, and they needed a few extras. So they grabbed me, pulled me over, and this is where I meet Shawn and Hunter for the very first time. They’re doing DX, and they’re saying, Okay, well, Shawn is talking with Hunter. He’s like, maybe I’ll talk to him really quick. Shawn turns to me. He goes, What’s your name? And this is off [camera], We haven’t began rolling yet, but we’re gonna roll live here at any minute. My name was Shawn Spears at the time, and I went, Shawn. And he goes, Stan. I’ll kick Stan. So he just said, your name is not Shawn, my name’s Shawn. Your name is Stan. So he actually gave me the name. No one else did. He just went, I’ll kick Stan. I was like, this is the best! He’s gonna kick me, just a kid in a candy store. But, yeah, he gave me the name. So I don’t know if anybody knew that, but it wasn’t creative, it wasn’t someone on the writing team or anybody else. Shawn Michaels, you’re at fault for Stan.”

On an accident leading to his nickname of The Chairman:

“So Cody was an EVP at the time, and we went back and forth on, I think we talked about this before. He said, swing for the fences. I said, hands? [He said] No hands. I went, all right. And you know I love that guy more than you know. He’s the godfather to my sons. I think it was maybe a week after I was done feeling horrible about what had happened, I kind of texted him. I said, Hey, man, I think we run this a little bit. Chairs and wrestling have been around since the beginning of time, but how can we kind of spin it? How can we make it a little bit different? How can we add an element to my entrance? How can we add an element to the danger as a character. How can we make something that’s been around different, or put a little spin on it, which is wrestling in general. So what if I just started calling myself the chairman? He goes, love it, and that was it.”

On possibly returning at number 10 in the 2024 Royal Rumble:

“I think it was too tight of a time frame. Once everything had to be settled and finalized. I think it was tight. But again, things evolve I think it was a last minute thing. Obviously, Royal Rumble is a massive event every year for WWE. So I think I just missed it, but I shot it out there, and they’re just like, oh, things are done. Things are set. Okay. It was just down the street. I was just down the street. I was ready. I was ready just in case I had some stuff in the mix, worked out, made up and just in case. Always be ready, but we never have to get ready.”

On fans missing Cassie Lee:

“She watches it a lot. She watches it more than I do. That doesn’t mean I don’t watch wrestling, it just means I’m busy a lot. I’m around, I can see a lot of stuff. Yeah, she keeps up on it. She still loves watching a lot of her friends, and she’s still getting the itch. So she’s already weight training, she’s doing all that kind of stuff. She’s getting back into the mix and things like that. When she feels 100% good to go there’s a ring close by, so she plans on getting back into it. She doesn’t know to what capacity, meaning no one said anything, no one said hey, when you ready, come on back. Like, not Impact, not anything, but with the working relationship. Who’s to say that that’s not a possibility? But yeah, she still misses it. I think she still has a little bit of an itch.” 

On how much longer he intends to keep wrestling:

“I was telling Tara, who’s on the medical staff here, who’s been here for well over a decade, she’s a sweetheart. We were kind of sitting off to the side in the gym, and a lot of the young talent were piecing things together. They were doing some workouts, stuff like that. And a lot of the young talent here are early 20s, or mid-20s max. I was just watching them all, and I just looked at Tara and I said, What’s crazy is that right now, not one of them is thinking that one day this will end. They’re all in the midst of the love and the passion and the excitement for it, which is a beautiful place to be in, and it will still be like that, even if you’re in it for a long time. I still have those things, but the reality of not being able to do this much longer, physically and actively in the ring has crept on me a lot more so in the last four or five years than it ever has before. So when I see young talent not even being a thing and not thinking about that, it’s just you realize almost how fast time goes and it puts it into perspective a little bit. I don’t sit there and get kind of sad about I sit there and go, Okay, well, let’s kind of maximize that time. I feel that way in any venture, just nothing lasts forever if you’re lucky enough to be a part of it in some sort of way. That’s why I kind of have other responsibilities, other than just in the ring, because I’m excited about that. I love this sh*t. This is all I’ve ever wanted to do since I saw the Ultimate Warrior beat Honky Tonk Man in like 10 seconds, whatever it was, faster than Punk beat me. But I saw that, and I watched my two uncles jump to their feet and high five each other. I was maybe six or seven, I just went I want to make people do that too. I don’t know, that’s the only memory I have. That’s the catalyst to what all this is. But there’s nothing else I want to do. There’s nothing else I hope to do. Because of all of this, I get to provide a wonderful life for my kids. So it just I’ll miss it. I know I’ll miss it, but maximize the time, enjoy the time, whatever you have left.”

On betting on himself:

“Maybe it’s human nature to always wonder if you made certain right calls and certain things as opposed to sitting back and going I did okay. I know for certain I am in the right spot right now, in it with everything and all the time has gone by and all the decisions that I have made, I can say wholeheartedly that I am in the right spot right now in WWE and NXT, and I’m very confident to say that I will retire and finish everything here. I don’t want to go anywhere else, and that’s not a shot to anybody else. It’s just I feel that everything that has happened in my career, everything’s taken place in my life as a human, as a performer, it is all led to be in this exact spot sitting with you right now talking about how good things just happen to work out. Life is good.” 

On a possible match with Cody Rhodes

“He hit a different level. Right now, we’re kind of geared and focused on the CW launch and the CW debut in Chicago, but let me know, you’ll probably see him again before I do. That’s how busy we both kind of are. And if you do, float it in his ear a little bit, he knows where to find me. I’m not hard to find. I’m not hard to find at all. No chairs, I promise.” 

What is Shawn Spears grateful for?

“Family, that I get to be a part of this and time.”

Ethan Page (@OfficialEGO) is a professional wrestler and the current NXT Champion in WWE. He sits down with Chris Van Vliet at the WWE Performance Center in Orlando, Florida to talk about his surprising arrival in WWE, winning the NXT Championship in record time, why he left AEW, the first conversation he had with Shawn Michaels, the upcoming NXT move to the CW Network on October 1st, being the subject of one of Joe Hendry’s famous parody songs and more.

Quote I’m thinking about: “Life isn’t about being perfect, it’s about being ridiculously passionate that people think you’re a little crazy” – Case Kenny

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On winning the NXT Championship in record time:

“I guess it is a record, if I’m wrong, it’s because that’s what I read on the internet. Fastest championship. Vic Joseph was saying this to me, he thinks that I have the most PLE main events consecutively in the fastest amount I’m on a really good run right now.”

On how it feels:

“Validating? I think that’s the perfect word, validating. It’s like, imagine your whole life you have this vision of what your potential could be, and no one around you sees the same vision as you. Then magically, the greatest wrestler of all time just has the same vision as you and is like, I’ll let you do that, here I am doing it. Yeah, the boyhood dream, dude.”

On the first conversation with Shawn Michaels:

“I was hidden in one of these back rooms in this building, and essentially it was like, Hey, I don’t know everything about you, but you seem like a guy that’s never been given a fair shot, so I’m gonna give it to you.” 

Do you know what he saw in you specifically?

“No, well also I’m not going to question it, because I’ve been in the game so long that someone looking me in the eyes and being like, I’m going to give you this chance, what you wanted to accomplish, you can try it right now. That was it for me. Someone’s telling me I’m giving you the ball. So if you do well, we’ll both do well. This whole thing has been extremely weird. Then to get the guidance of Matt Bloom and Terry Taylor and then Fit Finlay, any of these guys that I want to either pick something from or ask them questions, or they are just willing to just help you out. That’s not something I’ve ever experienced. It’s such a competitive business, especially everywhere else that I’ve been, you can have camaraderie with fellow wrestlers and stuff like that. But not many guys are just walking around being like, Hey, do you want to get better? This is how. No, because they want to do it themselves. They want that position. But here, especially NXT, I don’t know the main roster yet, but with NXT, this is such a great environment to hone your skills and to get better.”

On if he thought this was possible after leaving AEW:

“No. I had 70 independent dates scheduled because I was like, Oh, I got two kids. Got this house, these cars, I moved to America we just got our green cards. This is where we live now, so I have to make sure that my children are fed and the bills are paid. So no, I didn’t.”

On leaving AEW:

“It was time. Yeah, it was time. And I wasn’t getting what I magically got here, which was the opportunity to show what I bring to the table.” 

On there being a point where he might have been too old for NXT:

“Dude, I feel old! I’m training with 20-year-old college athletes that are freaks of nature. That’s what this place is, breeding freaks of nature. And then here’s my broken down 34-year-old ass in training and working out with these guys looking around like, Oh yeah, I’m the old guy now.”

On receiving the offer from WWE:

“I took all those independent dates, and I was just kind of betting on myself, trying to, I guess, get some upward momentum back into Ethan Page. I’m very big on following trends and patterns and I could tell that I was on a downward tick, and there wasn’t anything that was going to change there. So I had to kind of change my environment to be able to change my momentum. I booked up, maybe I’m over exaggerating, but up close to 70 shows for the remainder of 2024 and I did a great uh wrestling show in Winnipeg. And on my layover from Winnipeg to Detroit, because I was landing in Detroit to drive for Revolver wrestling in Dayton, Ohio, I got a phone call a number that I didn’t have my phone. They were like, ‘Hi, is this Ethan Page? This is so and so from the WWE.’ Yeah, sure! [They said] ‘We’d like to offer you a contract this long, this amount…’ I’m just like this is not real. I just go ‘Honestly, that sounds fantastic.’ They hung up on me. My phone rings instantly. ‘Hi, this is so and so from WWE.’ And I was like, whoa, wait, that phone call I just got was real? And you agreed to everything, [They said] ‘So we would like to email [the contract] to you, have it signed, send it over over.’ I’m like, whoa, whoa. Then I’m calling my wife, ‘I think the WWE just offered me a job.’ She’s like, Wait, aren’t you coming? Yeah, I’m on my layover. Like, I’m about to land, and I have to go do this show. But yeah, I think I’m gonna work for the WWE.” 

On using Ego’s Edge as his finisher:

“So, I mean, it actually goes back pretty far, because when I came to AEW, my finisher at the time at Impact was a spinning rock bottom. I used to call it the spinning Dwayne. So I would use that as my finisher. But when I looked at the roster at AEW, there were like seven people that were doing a rock bottom, a urinagi, or some version of that as a suplex. And I was like, oh, it’s very used. And the only person that was doing any kind of move where they’re hoisting someone up like that, was Lance Archer, and he did it where the person was facing forward, no one was doing the razor’s edge. At the time, I was doing the border toss on the independents as a false finish or secondary finisher. So I had just pitched that it would be my finish, instead of something that’s been repetitive. I always tried to avoid any moves that I would do, and I try it here too. That’s why I don’t do the jumping cutter anymore. I just try and make sure everything that I’m doing is not being done on the show. So when you see me, you see something fresh, you see something different, and you see what’s mine. It’s like, oh, that’s Ethan Page’s, whatever that is.” 

On NXT moving to CW:

“So huge. Just the viewership alone. You are growing in one day it’s like, oh, we’re going from this amount of people being able to see you to this amount of people being able to see you. Selfishly, I’m excited, as company wide, like CW seems very proactive with teaming up with us to promote this as something huge. When you have the network that’s excited to have wrestling to be promoted, I mean, obviously we’re excited about it. I think it’s going to be a very big collaboration.”

On the Joe Hendry song:

“No [he didn’t tell me what was in it], I also said I don’t care. I was just like, go for it. Whatever you find, go for it. Don’t mention my kids and I don’t care. Then he showed that stupid video. I’m glad you brought this up, because I told my wife that I really wanted to brag about this. It just didn’t seem like a thing to say on social media. So I’m glad I get to do it on your show. My daughter is now a published photographer and a worldwide videographer. She filmed that video of me in the Bowser costume, doing curls on Halloween, and then a video game magazine put pictures out of my Sega Genesis collection. And I was like, Oh, it be funny if my daughter took these photos. So I’m just saying she’s very talented for only being six years old and videographer for the WWE.”

On his WWE dream match:

“It’s probably Randy Orton. Yeah, I would say that is the [dream]. I mean, one of the best ever past 20 years here. How many more does he have? I don’t know. I mean, if I look at him, I’m gonna think a lot looks like a million dollars. He’s the guy. I mean, he’s the bar as far as how you want to be as a wrestler, he’s great. The Rock is obviously numero uno. I don’t know how many more matches he plans on having. I don’t know how many Egos Edges he has left in his career.”

What is Ethan Page grateful for?

“My wife, my children and the coaching I have here.”

Ken Shamrock (@ShamrockKen) is a retired MMA fighter and professional wrestler. He sits down with Chris Van Vliet at West Coast Creative Studio in Hollywood, CA to talk about his time in UFC and what made him transition to professional wrestling, being the special referee for the WrestleMania 13 match between Bret Hart and Steve Austin, his relationship with The Rock, whether a WWE Hall of Fame induction could happen, The Rock appearing on TNA as part of his TNA Hall of Fame induction, the scrapped MMA fight against Bobby Lashley, if he was ever planned to be in the Brawl For All tournament and more.

Check out Ken Shamrock’s Tru BK at http://trubk.com

Quote I’m thinking of: “Do not wait. The time will never be just right. Start where you stand, and work whatever tools you may have at your command and better tools will be found as you go along.” — Napoleon Hill

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On if there is a relationship with WWE:

“I’ve had a relationship with them forever, even since when I went away, we did a legends contract, so I’ve always been a part of them. It’s one of those things where I think I spent enough time there and did enough there that I feel like I’m a part of that family forever.”

Are you under a legends contract right now?

“I am. Yes.”

On the recent T-shirts appearing on WWE Shop:

“They’re constantly, always putting stuff out, so it’s been a good thing. Like I said, I feel like, you know, I spent enough time there and did enough things to where I feel like family.”

On not being in the WWE Hall of Fame:

“That’s a great question and I get asked that a lot, which I guess is a good thing, right? I probably think I’m in four or five different ones, wrestling included. But no, when people ask that, it’s not really something that I think about a lot. I enjoyed my time in wrestling. I thought while I was there it was enjoyable. I mean, I went into it because it was an opportunity for me because the MMA was struggling and I wasn’t able to make the money I needed to support my family, so I had to make a decision. So I made that decision to go into wrestling, not knowing how that would turn out. Obviously, it was risky, but I did it. And fortunately for me, I fell in love with it. It was a great opportunity for me, and I enjoyed, all the moments that I had there. A lot of them with The Rock, and a lot of people think it’s crazy, but I enjoyed the chair shot.”

On The Rock’s chair shot:

“Everybody keeps looking at that, and they say it over and, oh, man, that must have hurt. For me, it’s funny, because it would hurt so much more if I didn’t see it coming. Top of the head, back of the head. I wanted it. I was like, bro, you were not hitting me in the head, like the top of the head or back of the head. I want you to hit me right in the face. He’s like, shut up. He thought I was kidding. I was like, bro, come on, man. I’m not taking it to the back of the head or top of the head. I say, if you’re gonna swing, you swing for my face and I’ll take care of the rest. I mean, I literally said that, swing for my face and I will protect myself. And he looked at me with this bewildered like, where’s the punchline? Where’s the joke here? And I looked and I said, No, I’m serious. And he’s like, I’m not doing that. And I said [then] I’m not taking it. I said swing from my face. I’ll protect myself. And he goes, You sure? And I was like, Yeah. And I remember, look right at him in the eyes, and I go, you better swing it. And he says, Oh, I’ll swing it.”

How do you protect yourself?

“Well, he swung for my face like I asked him to. And I told him it’s not his responsibility. It’s mine. You, swing it and I’ll do the rest. And so he did, and all I did was just like I would in a fight. I tucked my chin and it hit me right in the forehead. And anybody knows how the skull is put together, the thickest part is your forehead. And just like within football, and now they can’t do it, but you usually hit with the forehead. And if you get punched, most of the time, if you hit somebody in the forehead, you break your hand. So I just logically thought if I was going to get hit in the head, hit me in the hardest part. That was a great moment, though, because I had no idea what it would look like, or what the impact of that would be. It was just basically a thought in my head, because I saw everybody else doing it, and I was like, Man, that is just a dumb way to take a chair hit in the top of the head, back of the head, and I ain’t doing that. Hit me in the forehead.”

On if a Hall of Fame induction could happen:

“Obviously any athlete that goes through a career and has made an impact wants to be recognized, and I do want to be recognized. But I don’t think of it until it’s brought up, right? It’s not something that I dwell on because I felt like everything that I’ve done in my life, I’ve been blessed to have been in those moments. What comes after that is just icing on the cake. And if that happens it’s going to be a true thrill. But like I said, it’s not something that I lose sleep over. I’ve really enjoyed my journey and very happy with the way my life has turned out.” 

On being known as The World’s Most Dangerous Man:

“A lot of that nickname or moniker or whatever you want to call it, there’s this unwritten rule in whatever sport you’re in, you cannot name yourself, you can’t give yourself that name. Fortunately for me, I got it through an NBC or ABC, I don’t remember which one it was of the world’s most dangerous things. So when it actually came out, it was one that I didn’t think I would like, just because of the nature of what UFC was in 93. People didn’t look at it like it was a normal thing, and they kind of looked down on it. There was this kind of cult following, and it wasn’t until probably UFC 5 that they kind of humanized the individuals and who we were, and we were no different than anybody else. We just chose a different job.”

On making the transition from MMA to pro wrestling:

“I had to make this decision on my own, because I wanted to take care of my family. My family came first, and doing what I wanted to do came second. It came down to that, my family or do what I love doing. So I chose to try to make the money I needed to support my family. Not just my family. I had six fighters living in a house and I supported them, every new fighter that came in, I trained them for six months to a year, and I had this gym with three different buildings, one for weight training, one for kickboxing and one for grappling, and three different buildings. And so I had a pretty good business going. And it was a decision I had to make in order to make money, to be able to support all that going on. And I felt, if I went into pro wrestling, that I could make the money I needed to keep it going, which was a risk, to see that if MMA would improve and get better, and then I could go back to it. And so I made that choice to go into pro wrestling because I needed enough money to support what I had built.”

On breaking Vader’s nose:

“Again, I didn’t know, because remember, I’m a fighter, and I just tried to go in and do what I thought was normal. So normally, I’m used to just sparring, right? You spar, but you don’t hurt guys. And that’s kind of what I did with Vader. I kind of went and sparred with him, didn’t want to hurt him, and I guess I ended up breaking his nose, didn’t know it. Then I find out later on that he gave me a receipt when he hit me hard, I went down real hard. That’s like the chair shot, where people look at it and go, Oh, Vader really nailed him, he must have pissed Vader off. I’m thinking to myself, what? What are you talking about? And then I watched him and I was like, that’s awesome! You guys really think that was really [hurt]. That’s awesome, man. I can do this.”

On what happened after the match:

“Even when we walked back to the locker room, I thought it was a crappy showing. But when I walked back into the locker room, I remember Bret Hart was the first one I looked at. He went, Dude, that was good. I’m thinking to myself it just didn’t feel right. I’ve been fighting all this time and I wouldn’t do this, and just didn’t feel right. And then Vader came up to me and says bro, good job, man. Good job. He said, I think he broke my nose. And I was like, Huh? He goes, he when you threw the knee. And I was like, oh, sorry. He goes, Ah, bro, I don’t worry about it, man. It was a good match. And I was like when I did it, I didn’t feel that good about it. But then when I watched, I was like, Damn, that was good, that wasn’t bad, and that was my actual very first one, really going and working with someone like that, right?”

On officiating the WrestleMania 13 match between Stone Cold and Bret Hart:

“I hadn’t been introduced yet, I hadn’t really been on the scene. So when they asked me to do it, and this was Bret Hart, Stone Cold, I’m like what am I gonna do? Shouldn’t it be a referee doing this? I don’t know what I’m doing. I’m not a referee. And you’re like, No, we think it’d be great, man. It would add that thing to it, you’re there, you’re going to make sure that nobody gets out of line, and you’re going to regulate these matches. I was nervous. I mean, this is Bret Hart and Stone Cold, these guys are it. I was so scared I was going to screw up the match or miss something, because I never ref, I’m not a referee. I remember going into that, and I’m thinking to myself, Man, well I guess I’m going to find out whether I’m staying or going, because if I screw this up, I’m gone. There’s no way I recover from this. So I went in and just I kept thinking to myself, all right. I tell you the reason why I was more nervous was that I didn’t know if I could act, if I could make things with my facial expressions, or doing what those guys do so good. I didn’t know if I could do that because everything I’d done to that point was legit. I knocked the heck out of people, and I meant what I meant. Now I got to go in and I got to do something that I don’t know if I can do at this level. So I remember going in there, and I would say probably a minute, minute and a half into the match, I completely forgot everything. I mean, it was like I was actually refereeing an MMA match. I literally went from being nervous, not knowing whether I could do this or not to I’m in it and it’s a fight. These guys are fighting. I didn’t have to change anything from what I knew. My career in MMA when I was in there with those guys, they were hitting each other. They were putting these moves on one another. And I kept thinking to myself, he’s gonna tap, he’s gotta tap, he’s literally tearing him up. Then all of a sudden he would reverse it and I was into it as much as the fans were, like it was that legit to me, and I was standing that close to him, and I know those guys beat the hell out of one another.” 

On taking the first People’s Elbow:

“It had to be a long time ago. I remember looking at that video. I mean, I don’t even think Rock knew how to perfect it yet, because when he was just starting, I remember laying on the mat looking up at him, going, bro, this is just not a good site. You don’t have to be standing over the top and with your legs spread pointing to the crowd that long, make your move! [laughs]. That was one thing great about working with The Rock is that I felt like that was a great opportunity for us to really put ourselves in the mix with the greats. Shawn Michaels, Stone Cold, The Undertaker. That was a loaded roster, and I felt like me and Rock had the opportunity to put us in the mix on one of the best matches on the card those nights that we were together. It felt like the more that we worked together, the better we became. And to a point too where I believe that we were rivaling any main event that they put on our card, and that was a testament to The Rock and some of the hard work that he put into those matches with me and him.”

On The Rock inducting him into the TNA Hall of Fame:

“I was being inducted into the Hall of Fame and you can only get so many [chances] to actually have somebody say something about you. I felt like The Rock was a very big opportunity for me in pro wrestling, there was one of those things in your career where you know that one thing helped you get where you needed to go. I felt like the matches with The Rock was a huge part of bringing me into that world of wrestling and becoming relevant. I know it was for him because prior to that, we kind of came in at the same time. Prior to that, he was struggling, he was with The Nation, kind of in a group of people, and no identity. I felt like when we were put together, we both got to really kind of become a figurehead in pro wrestling. I was already something in MMA, had already built that no question. But coming into this world, the fans had to identify me as something, and working with The Rock gave me that opportunity, because that was the real first opportunity for me to work a program with somebody, a long working program with somebody, and I felt we did a tremendous job.”

On The Montreal Screwjob why he left WWE:

“That was one of those times where it was uncomfortable, because I was so close to Bret. He helped break me into the business, because I went up, trained with him, worked with them, and then that happened. Again, I wasn’t in the conversations with Vince and Bret and wasn’t on the inside. So I don’t know what happened. I don’t know who was right and wrong, but I know who helped me. I know who worked with me and helped me understand the character that I needed to be. Then, of course, getting the opportunity to wrestle in the WWF, Vince gave me an opportunity. Bret helped me develop my character. It was a very uncomfortable spot for me. Then moving on past that it just felt like in that, in that moment, it felt like I had no identity, like I wasn’t going anywhere. There was no program.” 

On not being happy with some storylines:

“I was being asked to do other things that just weren’t comfortable. I’m not saying anybody was trying to hurt me or anything, but it’s just some stuff that I just didn’t feel comfortable doing [The Ryan Shamrock angle?] Yeah that and then, you know, my own personal thing was I just didn’t want to get in the ring with Chyna. I taught my children at a young age and they were at the time, eight, seven and five, young kids going to school. One of the things that I drilled into their head was that you respect women and that you don’t lay your hands on them. Then I was asked to do that, and I get it, this is entertainment. I get all that. But again, we talked about this earlier where my family comes first, and if I’m doing something that’s going to possibly, might not, but possibly confuse them, I’m not doing it. And it was not like WWE had it in for me, it wasn’t it. It was just things that I believed in, and it just felt like I was constantly going in a direction that had no end to it.”

Was there any resistance to saying no to working with Chyna?

“No, nothing at all. The fact is, it was very respectful when I said I didn’t want to do it. Now I may have gotten beat a few times, but it was no angering like that. I enjoyed my time and truly blessed to have the opportunities that I’ve had, but I believe that everybody has to make their decisions in life and try to do what’s best for them and their family. I felt at that moment that I needed to make a move and get back into what I love doing. Don’t get me wrong, I love wrestling, and I enjoyed it, and I probably would have stayed much longer if I felt like there was a direction for me. I just didn’t feel that.”

On the scrapped MMA fight against Bobby Lashley:

“Man, that was a long time ago. I don’t even remember, but one thing that I want people to know, and anybody that knows me, and anybody that’s ever been around me, and anybody’s ever trained with me knows this for a fact. I’m afraid of no one. Even to this day, I’m afraid of no one. It’s a friggin fight. You put a gun to my head I mean, yeah, I’ll be a little bit nervous, but my character in the way that I grew up, I’m not afraid that’s not in me. That’s not a part of me. So whatever happens throughout my career with different things, because it’s been probably three or four more, it fell through, and mostly because of the negotiations. I never negotiated my fights as I became bigger and bigger, I got agents to do that. So when they fell through, it had nothing to do with me. It’s the negotiations, and for whatever reason, and a couple of these other different things that people want to say, Oh, you just didn’t want to fight him. I promise you this, if you’re a fighter and you’re at that 1% level, that will never happen to anyone, not wanting to fight somebody. That’s not in our DNA. That’s not how it works. That’s not how brain fighters brains work. That’s what we do for a living man. It’s like, that’s how we make money. You think we’re afraid of an individual because we may get hit. Come on.”

So you both wanted to fight each other?

“Yeah. And again, I don’t know how or what happened and why it didn’t happen. There’s a couple of other ones too, that happened. I’m supposed to fight somebody in England. I forget his name, and it fell through at the last minute, and had to do something with negotiations, and all of a sudden they’re screaming he didn’t want to fight him. He was afraid of him. I was like yeah, that’s how I became a champion because I’m afraid to fight people. It’s unbelievable. But just as an education, man, anytime that ever happens, I promise you, it has nothing to do with the fighter.” 

On if Kurt Angle reached out to ask for permission to use the ankle lock:

“No, and he didn’t need to. I remember when it first started happening, people were like, you stole your ankle lock. And I was like, huh? That doesn’t even equate in my brain, What are you talking about? Well, he’s using the ankle lock. And I was like, I learned that from somebody. And then, of course, with what you said, Well, yeah, but you know he’s using it in pro wrestling. And I remember thinking to myself, yeah, but I’m not there. If he would have done it while I was there, then there would be a problem, like, Hey, bro, that’s my finishing hold. You can’t do that.”

On if he was asked to be a part of the Brawl For All:

“I was asked. I said No. Listen, I got paid big money, big, big money to fight [in the UFC]. So now they’re asking me to do this thing for free? Listen I think anybody that has been involved in pro wrestling understands how hard it is to gain trust in the locker room. If guys don’t trust you, they’re not going to work for you. They’re not going to allow you to do things that they feel they may get hurt with. So that was one of the things that Bret really instilled in me. It was being able to make sure that I had a relationship with the locker room. I would go up and say hi to people, shake their hand, be open to suggestions, building relationships, because you got to build trust. These guys got to trust me to go in the ring with them, and then they asked me to fight. I’m like, so now I’m going to go in there and beat the hell out of these guys and then go back and say, Hey, we’re going to do a pro wrestling match. I just felt like that was kind of going against the grain of what I was trying to do there. I guess they were paying, I don’t know how much it was 50 grand or something, if you won it. I mean, you guys asked me to come here and do a certain thing, and we negotiated a contract for that, and now you want me to actually fight. So I’m doing two things now, and I just felt like, Yeah, this is not for me. I am not persuaded by insults and by ridicule, people saying you’re afraid to go against the pro wrestlers and you’re afraid to get in there, you’re afraid of this guy, you’re afraid of that guy… That does nothing. You’re not going to shame me into trying to fight somebody. I mean, if I’m going to fight them, I’m gonna fight them, and we’re gonna negotiate something, and we’ll do it. But I’m not gonna be shamed into fighting. It just felt like that’s what was trying to happen, not WWF, just fan base, because they were pro wrestlers and they’re pro wrestling fans, and by me saying, No, I didn’t want to do that. I’m not going to do that. There was that whole scene behind the scenes where people were saying, Yeah, the Shamrock is afraid. I’m thinking to myself wow, how soon people forget.”

What would have happened if it was you versus Butterbean in the finals?

“Oh, Butterbean would have knocked that piss out of me! I got no business boxing that dude. That’s not my game. In a boxing match, because I don’t, I don’t know how that was, but I don’t believe you could have taken him down. But with the way that we could take guys down. That’s a different game. That was my game.”

What if it was an MMA fight?

“I mean, it’s over, there’s no question. I mean, I fought guys so much better than him that were strikers in the K1 that could kick and punch and knee and elbow, so no problem. But in a boxing match, man, he would knock the piss out of me.”

What is Ken Shamrock grateful for?

“The opportunity my family gave me, the opportunity in pro wrestling and MMA and family.”

Otis (@OtisWWE) is a professional wrestler signed to WWE. He sits down with Chris Van Vliet in Minneapolis, MN to discuss being a part of Alpha Academy and how Maxxine Dupri has improved in the ring, the origin of his name, his real life friendship with Chad Gable, learning to do the caterpillar, being a massive fan of Too Cool, winning Money in the Bank, the romance storyline with Mandy Rose and more!

Quote I’m thinking of: “Normality is a paved road: It’s comfortable to walk, but no flowers grow on it.” ― Vincent van Gogh

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On his size:

“So I was this size already in eighth grade. Basically the same height and obviously lighter because the amateur wrestling but yeah, I hit puberty really early, like third grade. It was bad. I got like the terrible acne under my eyes. I had to get popped every night.” 

On the nickname Dozer:

“Yeah, that nickname started because, with Tukey, it was funny because we first met in NXT he’s like I know the side sweep. Like I didn’t know anything about the side I just go straight forward. And I remember Dax Charles gave me the nickname but at first at first he was calling me the Bone Crusher, which was very annoying. So he had a big dip and he’s just like, you know what I’m gonna call you? The Bulldozer. I like it. So then it was easy to chant you know, especially at home meets, you know what I mean? It’s always a big thing, the heavyweights go up there and it’s either a complete sh*tshow or it’s a battle. You never know.”

On where Otis came from:

“I had three decisions. So I gave them a 12 [name] list. I was like, Man, this one sounds good. And they were like, No, this doesn’t sound good. And I was gonna be cannonball, but there was a previous cannonball before so I couldn’t do cannonball. So it was like, the list was Dozer, Terry Dukes, Otis Riker, was like the top three. And then I don’t hear nothing for a while. Then we were actually in the ring at Full Sail and I get this rub on my calf and I think it’s one of the referees. I’m just like, Hey, get off my ass. It’s Hunter, said hey, I want to talk to you. Pulls out this little piece of paper, what do you think about this? I’m like Otis “The Dozer” Dozovic. He goes eventually we’ll call your Dozer but just because I want to give you a real name. So of course we tried to push on the Dozer and still just became Otis.”

On early memories of watching wrestling:

“I remember my first time, I only remember because it was Raven. My dad was cutting up stuff for stew. It was such a random [selection], garlic, and stuff I had never heard of, chopping it up. I’m just watching Thunder and I just remember being like, I don’t know, I just loved it ever since and I watched Raw. But I grew up kind of in that Attitude Era and WCW so watched WCW, the Cruiserweights, What’s going on right here, then next thing you know, you got Sable? It’s just like, oh my god, Sable.”

On being a massive 2 Cool fan:

“I was the biggest 2 Cool guy. Oh, yeah. I remember meeting Scotty for the first time. He’s working on an indie show in Proctor, Minnesota at the fairgrounds. And he must have thought I was working him. It wasn’t like we snuck in. We just walked in. It was almost when they were building the ring and we were just walking in and Hey, Scott, and he goes hey, what do you want to do tonight? I’m like, Oh no, I’m just here to tell you I just won the Fargo national championship 2009 I did the worm on stage. I f*cking threw the f*cker, got him on his f*cking head. Got the points. I remember the referee was gonna do some sh*t. Because you wasn’t supposed to have your hand raised pretty soon after.”

On learning to do the worm:

“I remember it was called the sock hop in Cooper Elementary School. And mom says get your ass out of the house. You watch too much horror, watching too much damn wrestling. Get out the house. I’m gonna take you to sock hop, apparently it’s a form of dancing. You get in there and it’s typical. I’m not gonna dance with a girl. It’s kind of like fifth grade. I’m like, Alright, so walk up to the DJ and said, Excuse me, sir. Do you have Batter Up by Nelly? He’s like yeah, but I wasn’t planning on playing that. Play it next. Walked away. Next thing at home was waiting for the song to play. But 10 More Polka songs came on finally. That goes up. All the dudes dance with their chicks, I just dropped down, did it, boom. Got that first reaction attention. I’ve never been a big attention guy but it’s always been like, show some love to for your like craft and performing. So I drop down on there. Always been hooked [on wrestling] it’s a totally good addiction to have.”

On Maxxine Dupri improving:

“It helps that her best friend is Chelsea too. And Chelsea’s like, oh yeah, you’re gonna do that, aren’t ya? You know what I mean? Just that confidence builder. I love our whole women’s division to be honest with you. I’m a big Zoey Stark guy, she’s a badass worker, we have a stud-ass Women’s Division for sure.”

On Mandy Rose pitching the romance storyline:

“She was definitely the ignition for sure. Because you can it pitch all day long. But again, like with Mandy, she’s like, I’ll talk to Vince. Like, okay. Because I was just kidding around, I would see a bikini post on her IG and I would be like you look good, babe. And then it became this thing and last year on Google, it said is Otis married [to Mandy Rose]? It was just one post. And I’m sitting there going, Oh I can get some more leverage here. So I kept posting it just for laughs. And she’s awesome. The girls, they’re a blessing too. Because again, they’re like, it’s HR but we know you mean well. So yeah, but she talked to Vince came out and then we started rocking and rolling there. So I mean, but she definitely was like, Hey, we gotta do this.”

On the storyline playing out:

“It’s one of those things where I’m gonna kiss the world champion bikini model. Behave yourself. Every day was a test. We could never do a pre-shot. It was always live because somebody would mess up, and she’s just like, just got to be ready. I’m sweating terribly because I got to get a hold of a cake. And the box was so uncertain that I was like this thing falls during a live shot I don’t know what to do, but I don’t know. It was just like, you couldn’t find a grip on it. And of course, Ziggy, you know, top the cake, man. I love Ziggy man. It’s pretty crazy Ziggy gets in the picture. And like, it was his first singles match in the warehouse as WrestleMania was my first singles too. So it was like, it was bittersweet because I respected Dolph off a lot and it’s like damn, I wish it was better. Just that time but you know, times being the times.”

On saving Mandy Rose from the Royal Rumble elimination:

“We’re doing the curtain business, but my boots, you could barely see them. Literally someone goes, That’s Otis! I’m like F*ck sake! Guess I’ll spread out now they know it’s me. We got under the ring, and I remember Nick who was always under the ring, crew guy. I go, Hey, do you know where should I roll? What side? He goes, they didn’t tell you? I go No, I’ll just assume. So I just kind of kept just weaselling around that ring. It was cool because you watch it back, the crowd sees me but no one really knows happening until she finally stands up and then finally we get the big [cheer]. I felt so bad for her landing on me too. I’m so sweaty. She is just beautiful and just barely breaking a sweat. She’s standing on me. Hey, you got it babe. I missed Sonya DeVille. So did that spot too. So I was like, ah, catching two buff ladies. Yeah.”

On winning Money in the Bank:

“I don’t think there was a plan. It was kind of a shock because the whole day was like, we couldn’t get up on the roof for the longest time because of COVID stuff. It was like just sitting sitting sitting, do one thing and shoot it. So you were basically just sitting there in your gear. They were kind of bullsh*tting all the boys and kind of calling stuff when they give you more of a spectacular [spot], get it approved. Gets it approved. So it’s just like a long day that finally Jamie [Noble] was like you thinking King Kong up in there? I’m like King Kong? He goes yeah, come with me. Jamie is all fired up. He walks up just climbing this ladder with his cowboy boots. I’m like, Man, I’m not going up there. I hate heights. That’s why I go on the second rope. He’s like get your ass up here! And it was a long way down, it’s headquarters. So we got out there and he goes I’m gonna take a picture of you. Take your shirt off and roar! I go okay, like King Kong and really roar. I’m like, okay, I’m roaring, been sitting for 14 hours. Then they said you’re gonna win it. I’m like, Oh, okay. And then. Yeah, from there, but I think everything was always like, again, it was who’s healthy, who’s not. So that could have been a factor there with testing for COVID and all that. So there were a bunch of changes going on.”

On his WWE goals:

“Definitely a singles match at WrestleMania. I mean, everyone talks about the title. For me it’s basically, probably a big match with Gable hopefully would be cool.”

On Bray Wyatt:

“I always wanted to work with Windham, definitely. That’s going to be a fantasy of mine when I get to heaven basically, because like I always knew me and him could tear the house down. Two big guys, our styles aren’t exactly similar but he’s way more agile. The guy was phenomenal so yeah RIP Bray. But like that and work with certain guys too, newer guys coming in. But yeah, then obviously having that big, big title would be nice, but I for me this is doing what I do, this basically been like a blessing for me. And selfishly I’m doing it for myself because it’s that much of a love for me.”

What is Otis grateful for:

“Jesus, my family and friends and the boys.”

Stephen Amell (@stephenamell) is an actor best known for his roles in “Arrow” and “Heels.” He sits down with Chris Van Vliet at West Coast Creative Studio in Hollywood, Ca to talk about “Heels” coming to Netflix on September 15th, how he was cast for the role of Jack Spade in the show, CM Punk and AJ Lee starring in the show and being potentially responsible for Punk’s return to wrestling, whether or not he thinks there will be a third season, his match at SummerSlam 2015 teaming with Neville to defeat Wade Barrett and Stardust, if he thinks there is more to tell with the Cody Rhodes story, his match against Christopher Daniels at the first-ever All In show in 2018 and more!

Quote I’m thinking about: “Your life is right now! It’s not later! It’s not in that time of retirement. It’s not when the lover gets here. It’s not when you’ve moved into the new house. It’s not when you get the better job. Your life is right now. It will always be right now. You might as well decide to start enjoying your life right now, because it’s not ever going to get better than right now-until it gets better right now!” – Abraham Hicks

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On Heels debuting on Netflix:

“If you are a wrestling fan, Netflix is the place for you right now. We got Heels, which is 16 episodes, I counted it as one season. The way that I actually think about it is, do you remember in the Andre The Giant documentary, when they were saying that for the purposes of WrestleMania III Hulk and Andre had never wrestled, right? But in actuality, they had wrestled each other all over the country, like hundreds of times. God bless our original network, but as far as I’m concerned, Heels debuts on September 15.” 

On why he thinks Heels is one season:

“I mean, there is literally no time cut between episode 8 and episode 9, which would have been 101 to 201. It ends with the big match at the State Fair and the surprise ending. And the next episode picks up basically, with Alexander Ludwig, who plays My brother just walking out of the ring, direct cut.”

On being the perfect casting choice:

“So it’s my understanding that they tried to put the show together in 2017, maybe even earlier than that, and they couldn’t cast it. They couldn’t find the brothers. Then the project came back around in 2019 and it was an offer that went out to someone that wasn’t me, and from my understanding when the network said who they put up the offer to, the feedback that they kept getting was, did Steven Amell pass? Eventually, it came around. But it was really funny, man, because I was finishing up Arrow, and I think we had, like, maybe five or six episodes to go, and I was very, very specific with my manager. I was like, A) I’m taking a break from television. B) I’m not entering into another six-year contract right away. And C) I really don’t want to do anything particularly physical. Then my manager calls me up, and he’s like, listen, an offer is coming on this one. It’s going to be an excellent offer. Here’s the script, and I want you to hop on the phone with Michael Malley, who was our showrunner on Heels. I sit down and I read the script in about four pages, and I go, Oh, motherf*cker. This is obviously a yes. It was a yes right away. Five pages into the script, I was like, I obviously have to do this. And, yeah, the rest is history.” 

On his experience in the ring translating to Heels:

“Under no circumstances should I ever have attempted that, we could have cut around it in a variety of different ways. I do not have luck with the coast-to-coast. The only one that I’ve ever done where I haven’t hurt myself was the first take, which ironically we definitely ended up using. But when I did the coast-to-coast at All In, I didn’t realize it at the time, but I figured, okay, I don’t want to smack the back of my head, so at the last minute, I’m gonna bail out and try to just land on my left butt. We finished the match, and I’m back in there in the locker room, and I can’t figure out, it feels like someone’s put a tennis ball underneath my left hip. And actually got a text from The Big Show, and he goes that coast to coast looked pretty stiff, I think maybe it might have been. Anyway, I fractured my hip. I had to go right back to filming Arrow on like the Tuesday after this long weekend, and I definitely didn’t ask permission to go to a wrestling match, so I had to sit everyone down and go, I’m not to be treated any differently. I am fine. My hip hurts. I can’t make it worse. I can just slow down the healing process. But that also turned out to be the episode that had the most amount of stunts in the history of the show. And the first thing that I had to do on my first day back was go into this dead sprint and then slide under a door. And as I’m sprinting, I can just hear tearing in my hip. It was horrendous.

On his match at All In:

“First of all, Christopher Daniels just couldn’t have been a nicer guy. Was so helpful with me in the ring. I agreed to do it, but the only way that I would agree to do it is if I lost clean. Because I don’t think people ever do that in the celebrity matches. So I was like, Listen, I want to equip myself really well. I want to tell an actual story. But I want to get one of those, 1, 2 oh! But then I want to lose straight up. And CD was like, Absolutely not, no way, absolutely no way. And I said, Chris, I’m not doing it unless you go over clean, and we can shake hands at the end and then I get to have my moment. I felt like also that’s the way that you get respect in the industry. You go in there, you change with the boys, and it’s like, no, I’m gonna lose clean. But no, he took care of me in that match, because there’s so much adrenaline. So what inevitably happens is you forget to breathe. Straight up, you will go through some sort of sequence in the ring, and you’ll forget to breathe, which leads to you blowing up. I think three minutes into that match I grabbed him, I’m like, we need to go home. He went, shut the f*ck up. Don’t even move. I’ll take care of you. And he did. Yeah, he was great.”

On his match at SummerSlam 2015:

“Well, I mean, first of all, I wouldn’t recommend to anybody to have their first match at a Premium Live Event in f*cking Brooklyn. They’re like Hey, listen, this crowd is not going to be the easiest and the one thing that you can’t mentally prepare for. First of all, I came out, I was so nervous that I forgot to get in the ring. If you go back and watch the match, Cody was like, you forgot to get in the ring because he was going to powder out and do all that stuff. First of all, I went and trained with Cody. [How long did you train for?] I went on a loop with them. They were on Vancouver Island. So I went to that show, and then they were in Vancouver the next day. Cody and I had dinner that night with Brandi and my wife Cass and then I went down to Everett with them again. That’s when we did the run-in, where he face washes me, and then I come into the ring. I was the guest host at Raw, so I had to sit in the crowd for the entire show and this didn’t happen until hour three. We had practiced this, and the agent that we had was Road Dogg, an awesome guy. I was like Cody’s gonna face wash me and then I want to jump up onto the apron and then sort of like whip myself over the ropes into the ring. Road Dogg was like, No, you can’t, you gotta slide under the bottom rope. And I’m like, I don’t want to slide under the bottom rope. I want this to be dynamic, I want to jump up onto the apron. And he goes, okay, but just so you know, if you miss and you stumble, there will be no match at SummerSlam because you will have lost the fans forever. They want to hate you. They don’t want to like you. Okay? You’re just some actor that’s taking away a spot. So it’s like, you’re welcome to jump, but if you miss… So about an hour and a half into the show I realized, Oh, my God, we’ve practiced this a bunch, but I was practicing it in shorts and now I’m wearing dress pants, am I going to be able to do this? So, there’s probably someone who saw me walking around the back of that arena jumping in my dress pants to make sure that they weren’t going to rip. Once I got into the match, it was good, but we decided that we were gonna start the match off with Cody springboarding into the ring, and then me springboarding as well. He’s like, Oh my God, holy smokes. I was terrified of messing up the springboard, I practiced it 100 times. But I even said to him right before the match. I go, do we have to start with the springboard? And he was very, very accommodating and really, just kind of let me do what I want. But he goes, Yeah, we’ve got to do the springboard.” 

On if Heels season 3 is possible:

“I think that season three is a possibility. People are gonna have to watch it on Netflix. It’s gonna have to line up schedule-wise for me because I now have another job that’s in first position. But listen, without trying to spoil it, we didn’t want to send my character out quite literally on his back. There was always the idea that we would tell more of a story. I think there’s more to be told. I think that in the way that there’s no real season one and season two, because eight and nine really line up. I think that if we did come back, you might see a little bit of a time jump. That’s sort of what the showrunner has pitched.”

On there being more to be told with his Cody Rhodes story:

“I hope so. Yeah, I really hope so. First of all, I could not be prouder of that guy. To do what he did, to walk away. I don’t want to speak for him too much. But I really do think that after our match at SummerSlam, because I remember it was like Neville pinned King Barrett, and then they did the camera thing where Cody’s walking out of the ring they got the camera on him, and they got the camera on me, which is the sign, the universal sign in wrestling of we’re not done, we have unfinished business. So the plan was, as best I can recall, was there was a pay-per-view after SummerSlam, and then the October pay-per-view was going to be in LA at Crypto Arena. Cody and I were supposed to have a cage match. We were getting ready to send a ring up to Vancouver for me to do a bunch more training, because I basically faked my way through the SummerSlam match, I could still probably take you through the beats of it right now. So the plan was to actually go more the length I went with Christopher Daniels, like 12-15, minutes. And again, the plan was to lose clean. Then all of a sudden, Cody just calls me up, and he goes, Look, man, I don’t know what’s going on, but our match just got shelved, and no one will give me an explanation why. I am devastated, and I’m deeply embarrassed. I was like, Look man, it’s okay. But I really think that was one of the contributing factors to him leaving.

On Peacemaker’s insult at Arrow:

“That was a little unnecessary. I didn’t f*cking appreciate that at all. Okay, I’m just gonna come right out and say this. Between the movies and between Peacemaker, a little bit like, our show was kind of treated like sh*t. I get it, we’re on the CW, I get it. It’s TV. But I also get the fact that when people think about the most recent iteration of DC, okay, they don’t think about the Snyder cut. They think about the Arrowverse, and we got crapped on for years and years and years, and this just seemed excessive. Again, I’m not actually mad, but like, just remember hearing that and being like f*ck those guys! Seriously. I’m up here, I’m working just as hard as anyone else. You know how hard it is to play a superhero with no superpowers for 23 episodes a year? It’s really, really, really hard. I’m not looking for a prize, but maybe don’t sh*t on our show.” 

On meeting John Cena:

“I’ve met John a handful of times. There couldn’t be a nicer, more genuine person. If I should be mad at anyone, should be James Gunn for writing that in the first place. But he could not be a nicer guy. He’s such a good guy. It’s not a personal vendetta against him.” 

On being part of The Bullet Club and his ROH match:

“We had set up a great spot with me and Kenny where we hit the Hart Foundation’s final move, the clothesline, and we’re supposed to go back down and then we were supposed to wait. Now I’m supposed to wait for Kenny’s call, we were both supposed to kip up at the same time and then celebrate in the ring the way that he does. I was so excited that I kipped up immediately, didn’t wait for him. That I think that is the hardest thing to do in the ring. The hardest thing to do in the ring is to slow down. Right before my first match, Hunter came up to me and he went, listen, when you get out there, slow everything down. Then when you are positive that you’re going too slow, slow it down. And then when you think there is no chance in the world that you can go any slower, slow it down. I think back to kipping up when I should have waited for Kenny, or when I went through the table in a match against Christopher Daniels, like I could have taken 20 seconds to climb those ropes and really let the crowd stand up and let everything build. I did the whole thing in like 2 seconds. Didn’t even have time for the for the announcer. He just went, ‘Steven Amell, what are you doing?!’ Although that didn’t hurt at all.”

On Heels leading to a CM Punk return:

“So Phil wasn’t originally in that part. We had shot a bunch of stuff with a different actor playing Ricky Rabies. But then with everything that went down with the pandemic, they had to bow out. So we got Phil in, and he was great, just a great guy to work with, good actor and I stand by my match that I had with him. It was a lot of fun. And if that’s 5% of the reason could be that we got him back in back in the business, then I’m good with that.” 

What is Stephen Amell grateful for?

“Healthy kids, my wife and that I have had wonderful people to work with.”

Dave Bautista (@DaveBautista) is an actor and retired professional wrestler. He sits down with Chris Van Vliet in Hollywood, CA to talk about his new movie “The Killer’s Game”, how he recruited WWE Superstar Drew McIntyre for a role in the film, slimming down to 240lbs, his early wrestling days as Leviathan and Deacon Batista, why he couldn’t do a retirement tour like John Cena is planning for 2025, his friendship with Triple H, if he could have done more in the wrestling world, the botched ending to the 2005 Royal Rumble that saw Vince McMahon tear his quads, Mark Jindrak being in Evolution, his iconic theme music and more!

Quote I’m thinking about: “Time is the only currency you spend without ever knowing your balance. Use it wisely”

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On starting his acting journey:

“I did an episode of Smallville, and I did it because I was a fan. I was a fanboy. I wanted to be on a Superman-related show. I just had no interest in acting. I wouldn’t say I did a film and it made me fall in love with acting. I did a film that made me want to be better at acting. I did a film called Wrong Side of Town. I did it, and I didn’t think much of it. Again, I was on top of my wrestling game, and I loved wrestling. I was obsessed with it. That’s all I wanted to do. I went and I did this film and I realized what a horrible actor I was, like so bad. I was really embarrassed, and I just wanted to prove to myself that I could be better. I mean, I left that set just feeling unfulfilled, and I had the itch, man. I just wanted to get better. And so, as you know, Wrong Side of Town, that kind of started my whole journey.”

On the wrestler once known as Deacon Batista now being one of the biggest actors on the planet:

“It’s weird hearing that, because I don’t think about myself like that at all. I feel like I’m really starting to break into my own, my career is [taking off]. It took all these years to kind of, I feel like I’m just getting started. Now I’m starting to get lead roles now. I’m starting to build on my career. And they’re not like massive lead roles. I’m not doing massive studio $150, $200 million films. I’m not on the top, so I’m not like a big movie star. But I’m coming into my own.”

Do you want to be at that level?

“I do want to be at that level, and there’s a particular reason. One, I really want my company to be successful. But also, I’ve kind of learned throughout my journey that the bigger star you are, the more you can get things done. It’s just easier to get things done. It’s the nature of business. People see you as a commodity, they see that you can generate money. Same with wrestling, if they see that you can generate revenue for the company, then they’ll make you a star.” 

On slimming down:

“I got really big for a role, and it was uncomfortably big. Knock at the Cabin. I got really big. I was around 315 pounds and I put the weight on really fast. [Not like 315 in WWE?] No, definitely not. When I was younger I was carrying lots and lots of muscle, this I had to put on between films. I had a very short period of time to put this weight on. I packed it on with french fries and pancakes. That’s how I did it. The director asked me, he said I don’t want you to look like a powerlifter, I just want you to look like a great big guy. So now, looking back at it, I probably overdid it. I was probably a little too big. But at the time, I was just thinking, I gotta get big, I gotta get big, I gotta get big. I put on an uncomfortable amount of weight, and it took me forever to shed it off. And then I noticed, the more I trimmed down, the better I felt. I also noticed, the more I trimmed down, the better I looked on camera, the better I looked next to other actors, because typically, even at this weight, it’s weird, because people think for me, people say, God, you’re skinny. I’ve even saw online that some people are worried about my health, and when I say it out loud to people, I’m 6 foot 4 240 pounds. When you say that out loud, it sounds like I’m a big person. But to me, because people have seen me so much bigger over the years they think I’m anorexic, but I’m still a large human being. So at 6 foot 4 240 pounds, next to your typical actor, I look like a gorilla, and it’s distracting. So I’ll probably lose a few more pounds because I’m basically killing myself to be this trim. I mean, I’m training hard, not only training hard, but my calories are pretty restricted.”

On not being sure about his audience:

“It’s weird. I always tell people I’m not really sure where my audience is, because I’ve been kind of all over the place with my career. A lot of the fans who were real hardcore fans when I was wrestling, they love me because they love that character. And obviously, I’m not that character in person, and also because I’ve aged and I’m not jacked and I have grey hair and I have a bald head now, I don’t know if they still are invested in me. But again, maybe it’s a little bit of my insecurity.” 

On life before wrestling:

“It’s weird, because I don’t know how people thought that I was brought up. But when I was a kid, a lot of times we didn’t have food. Me, my mom and my sister slept in a basement of a house in DC and we all shared one bed. I didn’t grow up with money, I grew up with less than no money. I had a pretty rough childhood, and I was broke until I was well into my 30s, and this is what led me into wrestling. I was broke and had two kids, I was bouncing and I couldn’t afford to buy my kids Christmas presents one year, I had to borrow money to buy my kids Christmas presents. I was so humiliated that I said, I got to make a change, I got to do something. I didn’t have many choices because I had no education, high school dropout. So I started, I was an athletic person, I was enormous. I thought I’ll give wrestling a shot. I failed in my first attempt, then I paid someone to teach me how to wrestle, Afa of The Wild Samoans, God rest his soul. It was so heartbreaking that he’s passed away, and that was kind of it. That’s where my journey started. But even after that, it was a long, long road. A lot of people didn’t believe in me. Even when I was in developmental camp down OVW, there was people with the WWE, John Laurinaitis, who wanted to fire me. But I just kept digging in and digging in and digging in and digging in until I finally got my real first opportunity with Evolution, and I had access to Triple H and Ric Flair, I mean, two of the greatest professional wrestlers ever. I wasn’t going to blow my shot, so I just had blinders on. I put everything else in the back burner and focused on my wrestling career.”

On if being in OVW was a help or a hindrance given the others in his class:

“It didn’t hurt me as far as they went, they only helped me. They only drove me. When you are surrounded by greatness, it brings out the best in you. These guys, to say they were competitive would be a massive understatement, it was a class full of studs. These guys were athletes, so I was good there, I needed them. Thank God they were there. What hurt me was my character that I had in OVW. I always get grief about this because people think that I don’t respect Jim Cornette. I really do. The reason I do is because Jim Cornette taught us so much about the history of wrestling. He taught us so much about the traditions of wrestling. But I won’t back down when I say that career, that character [Leviathan], it stunted my growth in OVW because I had nothing but squash matches. That’s what I did. I went out and in two or three moves, and my matches were over. I had Goldberg matches, and they didn’t. I didn’t progress like the rest of the guys. I didn’t progress like Brock Lesnar, Randy Orton, those guys are incredible athletes. Obviously, with Randy being a legacy, I think he was born and bred into this business, but I was just stunted a little bit. I never got to speak on the mic. I spoke on the mic a few times and it was me screaming into the mic. But I think my growth there was a little bit stunted, I went into the WWE completely unprepared, and it was like a whole new learning curve. I remember, and I will say it over and over, that Fit Finlay in a day changed my life. I went and that was kind of a last-ditch effort. John Laurinaitis sent me down to work with Fit, Steve Regal and Dave Taylor. Fit just took me aside and just started talking to me like, what’s wrong with you? More than the physical stuff, he just got in my head a little bit and made me see things differently and a light bulb just went off in my head.”

On how Drew McIntyre became involved in the project:

“Really just pointing everybody towards Drew, because I was having a conversation with J.J. [Perry – Director], and he said, I need a great big guy who’s almost intimidating to you, a guy who would be kind of bigger than you and I also need him to be able to pull off a Scottish accent. He was like, Do you know anybody? I was like, Man, I got the perfect guy [laughs]. I immediately thought of Drew, and I loved Drew. I’ve always gotten along with Drew and I’ve known Drew probably since he was a teenager. I think it was like 18 or 19 when I met him. So I pointed him in this direction. I sent him a bunch of pictures, some reference stuff, and I was like, this is the guy, don’t even look any further. And he said, Oh, I love him. So immediately I hit up Drew and said, Hey, man, would you be interested? He said, absolutely. I said, check with Hunter, make sure you are cool. And thank God Hunter, because things have changed a lot. I think Hunter changed the company in a lot of great ways, but he’s very open-minded to letting people do stuff outside of the company because he really understands that the bigger star they become, the more attention it will bring back to WWE, which is a great thing. Where I think in the past, it was just kind of the opposite of everything. We wanted to keep everything contained, everything, everybody in-house, which is why I ended up leaving the company because I wasn’t afforded the opportunity to do stuff outside of the company. But now, the way things are now, and their structure, Hunter is like, yes, we want you to do this. This brings more eyes onto the WWE.”

On if he keeps in touch with Triple H:

“I don’t know if he likes my movies. He probably thinks I’m a sh*t actor [laughs]. But I’ve always clicked with Hunter. I get Hunter, and Hunter gets me, and I think we could go a year without talking to each other, and then when we pick up a conversation, it’s like we just talked to each other yesterday.”

On if he made it to the top of the wrestling world:

“No, I think if I had stayed longer, I might have. There’s a part of me that always thinks right guy right time. But I don’t know what I would have achieved if I had been like a John Cena or Randy Orton, been the 13, 14, 20-time World Champion, I don’t know. But I think what I did in the short period of time that I was actually there, my run between 2005 and 2010 I’m proud of. I can say that I’m proud of it. I’ve had the conversation with Hunter about going to the Hall of Fame and there was always a part of me that makes me feel like my career is not worthy of going into the Hall of Fame. Well he said this to me, and this makes sense. He said, you accomplished a lot in the short period of time you were there, I think it’s worthy. But if you don’t feel like it’s worthy, look at it this way, what you’ve accomplished outside of the company makes you a Hall of Fame WWE wrestler, and I would tend to agree with that. I think I’ve accomplished a lot, and I’ve never turned my back on my roots. I’ve always been very proud of it, been very open about being a WWE superstar, and I think I’m a good ambassador for the company. I think if on those merits, if they want to put me on the Hall of Fame, I’d be proud to accept that.”

On John Cena and the upcoming retirement tour:

“I get along with John. I respect John a lot, a lot more than people think I do for some reason. I think the internet and I think fans have built this rivalry between us, which there really isn’t, but this is how we’re different. I would never do this [retirement tour]. I wouldn’t, I couldn’t. It would feel disingenuine to me to go around and I just couldn’t. But where I see his point where he wants to go around and he wants to personally thank all the fans, but there’s just something in me where I just couldn’t do it. It would feel uncomfortable to me, like accolades feel uncomfortable to me. I could never be the type of babyface who was saying good stuff because I wanted to get the crowd to cheer for me. I couldn’t be that guy. So I love and respect what he’s doing with his whole tour to say thank you to the fans, but we’re just different that way. I couldn’t do it. I went out the way I wanted. I retired the way I wanted. I didn’t want to make a big deal out of it. I announced my retirement on Instagram and I knew I was going to do it. I just didn’t want to tell anybody I was going to do it because I didn’t want anybody to say, no, no, you got to come in, you got to give a speech, you know, the fans. I don’t know, just something about it would have felt false to me. I couldn’t do it.” 

On the 2005 Royal Rumble:

“Well, the whole day I thought I was getting fired. The whole day was just a nightmare. [They didn’t tell you you were winning?] No, I knew I was winning. But what happened was, so I think we were in San Francisco the night before, and so I stayed there instead of driving to Bakersfield. I stayed there because my mom lives there, and I want to stay and I want to spend time with my mom. So I got up the next day, and I drove and I was really late to the show. I was really late to getting there, and I knew that I was supposed to go over that night and it was like a big deal and I was going to go to WrestleMania. Vince thought that I was being super disrespectful by showing up late, and he was pissed. I thought he was going to change his mind and it was going to change, like the whole storyline. So I got there, and he ringed me out as soon as I got there. But then we [had] the match, and it was botched, and I totally take the blame for it, because I went over. I knew what the finish was, and I just went over. I just went over and thank God we landed when we did kind of at the same time, it was a miracle. Then when I saw Vince coming down, I was like, I’m getting fired. Most of my career, until later in my career, throughout my career, especially in OVW, I thought any day now I’m getting fired. I’m getting fired. I was just so happy to be there.”

At what point do you realize he’s torn both quads? 

“I think later on, I didn’t realize during the match, I didn’t know why he was sitting there. I had no idea what was going on, I was just worried about the match. Then they got him out of there. I think I found out later on. The funny thing was, so I can’t remember where we were at the next day. But it was the next day, and I got to the building and somebody immediately said, ‘Vince wants to see you in his office.’ I was saying, Ah, here it comes. So I went to his office, and my heart is beating, just in my head I’m packing my bags. I walk into his office, and he’s sitting, he’s got his crutches beside him, and he’s all bandaged up. He just starts laughing. He’s laughing at the top of his lungs, ha, ha. I was like, ‘You’re not gonna fire me?’ And he goes, ‘No, I loved it! It was real! It was so great, and it was real, and nobody knew what was gonna happen.’ He loved it. I think that Vince thrives on chaos. When you think about some guy, he’s a billionaire, he’s accomplished everything it could. He’s bought everything that he could ever buy. So what’s he got left, excitement! I think because that moment was so chaotic, I think it just excited him and it exhilarated him. So even though it was a total botch, I think he just had so much fun in that exhilarating, exciting moment that he kind of thrived on it and he forgave me.”

What is Batista grateful for:

“Health, that my mother raised me the way she did and for dogs.”

Drew McIntyre (@DMcIntyreWWE) is a professional wrestler currently signed with WWE. He sits down with Chris Van Vliet in Los Angeles, CA to discuss his role in the upcoming movie “The Killer’s Game” with Dave Bautista, how Batista got him in the movie, if he plans to star in more movies in the future, his losses at both Clash at the Castle shows, his rivalry with CM Punk and if he has ever gone too far in his promos, the viral photo with AEW star Jack Perry and how it came together, his war with Gunther and Sheamus at WrestleMania 39, beating Brock Lesnar at WrestleMania 46, why he believes in Joe Hendry and more.

Quote I’m thinking about: “Most people tell themselves that if they felt better, they’d do the thing – when it’s actually doing the thing that makes you feel better.” – Mark Manson

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On the bracelet:

“I’ve seen some of the memes about it being more meaningful, or people have more of an emotional attachment right now than some of the titles, which may technically be true right now. But eventually, the titles will kick up their gear in the storylines, et cetera. But I’m gonna be so bold as to say this right now as perhaps the top prize in all of wrestling.” 

On doing the best work of his career and what changed:

“I mean, it’s all across the board. Just with the new management coming in, new creative process, Hunter kind of leading the ship and giving a lot of people, basically everybody, but specifically the ones that have been there for a minute, the chance to hey, if you’ve got more to show, then show it, this is your chance. There’s no wrong answers, go for it, and if it fails, it’s on you. If you’re willing to take that wrist slap, and I’m willing to take a wrist slap, a fining a firing to be true to myself and the relationship now I have with creative, how much they know the character, because it’s essentially me with the volume turned up. When it comes to the Punk stuff, especially because I can’t stand the guy, it’s easy, but it’s awesome. And to see across the board, not just for myself, just how many characters have stepped up and standing out right now and Raw is a lot easier to watch. Three hours is still a lot, but it’s a lot easier to digest these days. The show flows so well. There’s so many popular characters. It’s amazing just to see wrestling so healthy and everybody thriving.” 

On getting a role in The Killer’s Game:

“He [Batista] called me and had a pitch. I thought it was just the catch-up, and he mentioned that he’s working on his new movie, The Killer’s Game. Told me a bit of the premise, which I loved. The Hitman that takes out the bad guys and is never going to have that happy part of his life. He does what he does, and he finds the right girl and everything’s perfect until it’s not perfect, and he decides to take a hit on himself. We’re not going to ruin it any more than that. But it gets pretty exciting. A lot of people come to kill him, including this guy. And then you need some extra characters. The director, J.J. Perry had said, I’ve got this idea for this Scottish brothers, the Mackenzie brothers. I have one of them. The other one, I just want to be, you know, the big, imposing guy that can feasibly and realistically beat you up. I just want them to have these thick Scottish accents and be just wild, kind of drinking party badasses that are somewhat unintelligible because of their thick accents. And Dave basically said, I actually know that guy, he exists. He called me.”

There were subtitles in this movie for your character:

“I’m trying not to spoil anything, but it was fun, like just having J.J say Just go ridiculous, use whatever Scottish slang you want, because I don’t know it. So just thinking back to all the crazy words I used to say back in Scotland and the current slang, asking my friends, you know, what’s some of the current slang that we find? Using this, and there’s no swearing restrictions that we might have in WWE sometimes. Come on Netflix! So yeah, I got to freely use a lot of words, including my favourite word in the world, the C word. People are so offended by that word in America, and I’ve never understood why. The Butcher [from The Boys] is doing a heck of a job right now helping acclimate Americans to it, but Australians and Scottish people use it as a term of endearment, and I was horrified to see this reaction the first time I used it. In 2007, somebody sat down and almost cried because I mentioned in their presence. So, yeah, if I do anything from this movie, I just want to get people more comfortable with words. I don’t think this will hurt them, they’re just words.”

Is this the first of many movies?

“We’ll see. It’s just a fun journey as far as I’m concerned. All I ever wanted to be was a wrestler since I was five years old. Very lucky to get signed straight from university. Have the journey I’ve had, and if the right opportunity comes up, like the character, you saw it yourself, it wasn’t big bruiser number three, just standing being big and angry. I was like, I’m not gonna do that. Like, thankfully, wrestling provided a living where I can pick and choose what I want to do and I want to wrestle. But I was like, this looks fun, and it was fun. So something comes up like that, I’m gonna do it.”

On Joe Hendry:

“He’s killing it. It’s awesome. I mean, to a lot of people, it’s oh my goodness, this overnight sensation. Joe Hendry is not an overnight sensation. He’s been working hard. He’s been paying his dues. He’s been perfecting his shtick that we’re all seeing right now, and I always put over his video. He’s got one on me, I’m Drew, so make sure you look it up. I always tell the story just if you’ve not heard me say it. I didn’t know what the video was. I told them, Don’t show me. I want to have a legitimate reaction in the ring to his video. So I’m Drew came up to the tune of I’m blue, and I was supposed to be angry, and I was laughing so much. Had my hair in my face trying to cover my laughter. It’s just so entertaining. There’s always that entertainment aspect. But he’s come so far in the ring as well. He’s put it all together, and, yeah, he’s about a 10-year overnight sensation.”

When they called you The Chosen One, did you feel like it?

“I guess in certain ways. But a lot of people did not like it backstage, so I didn’t feel as much backstage with the professional jealousy that I didn’t realize how significant it was and the things that were being said then it was all out of jealousy. Why is this kid getting this huge opportunity when I’ve been here for all these years? But for the opportunities on TV, I certainly did for a period. And looking back, I know obviously I could have done things a little bit differently, but at the same time, I just didn’t have those tools in my wheelhouse to do things differently. And we all go through our journeys for a reason to end up at the final destination.”

Did WrestleMania 40 feel like your moment?

“Yeah, it did. I mean, the match itself, opening Wrestlemania, myself and Seth, one of my greatest rivals. We have a big professional rivalry, and the match itself is perfect, just with a story going into it. We’ve had so many matches like technical, high fly, near falls left and right. This was okay, just starting off, Claymore, just unload, unload, unload, unload, till somebody doesn’t get back up. And finally, I put the last round in Seth, and had that moment where the crowd were chanting, you deserve it. Wrestlemania. Seth had that moment telling me the same thing, which meant a lot, and then being able to present the title to my wife, who has been such a big part of the journey. But no, I’m not going to talk about what happened after that. But just that five minutes or whatever I dragged it out to because I made sure I milked every second of it, because that was very real. It was very emotional. To be able to give her the title and say, this is yours too. And hugging my brother, who’s my original tag partner, was very, very cool. And then Punk f*cked it up.”

Did WrestleMania mean more than if you had won at Clash at the Castle:

“I think so. It’s weird, because you look at certain moments and in the moment when you’re living them you’re like this is ridiculous. We should have found a way out of this. Theory could have cashed in, and I could have pinned him because we had to protect The Bloodline and Roman at that time, that’s the top story in the company, the top character. And perhaps at that time, I was like, I just feel this is a bad move. That thing with Tyson Fury. That was stupid. There’s no excuse for that. That’s the worst moment in my entire career. We did the bit, the song, and then I told him, Hey, you want to sing Sweet Caroline, because British fans [love it]. They’re upset that I lost. They don’t know American Pie. He was like, Nah, I’m good. I’m not gonna fight you, you’re Tyson Fury. I figured we’re off the air that’s why I started doing the Oasis bit and singing Don’t Look Back in Anger. Just got the crowd going. And I was like, Oh, this sucks, but we’re off the air. Then I found out we’re still on the air. It was a whole thing. But anyway, I digress, Oasis are back together. Gotta get some tickets for that. Yeah, that night, I was very upset. How does McIntyre rebound from this, which took a minute to do, but because I didn’t win that night, the way things worked out, the story we’ve been telling that was such an integral part of the story, especially initially with the character shift with Jey Uso moving from SmackDown to Raw and bringing up the trauma and PTSD McIntyre had from The Bloodline of what they had done to cost not just me, but my family that moment, who were all in the front row. My dad, my wife, my brother, my sister-in-law, my cousin, like everybody is there who’s been missing me for all these years and I’ve not seen my nephews grow up. That was going to be our moment. This trauma is brought up by this Bloodline member just showing up and everybody cheering him and saying a silly little word Yeet and doing his little silly dance. And now, wait a minute, this guy’s a bad guy, and then suddenly people start turning on me. So if it wasn’t for what happened at Clash, if it wasn’t for the journey and the way we tell stories now, we can tell stories now, we wouldn’t be where we are right now.”

What about in Scotland?

“That was a tough one. Really, really tough one. The same time, if I win, then I’m right. Sometimes it’s okay to be right. Yeah, that one really stung.”

Was there a moment where you thought are you sure this is the right way to go?

“Yeah, there’s always that moment and I like in the environment we’re in now, it’s story above all else. I didn’t feel that way in the past. I was like, if we don’t do this now, things could change in a couple of weeks. It’s a lot of pivoting left and right, and characters and stories changing consistently. Now I know we will stick to the story. It hurt, but I see what we are now, and I’m like, Okay, if I won that night, then I’m just, yeah, I did it. I’m right, go screw yourselves. Because of what happened and much as I can’t stand him, that moment was something that would be replayed forever, just the big near fall at the end, everybody in my freaking home country going insane. One two, and it’s that piece of sh*t counting the fall and cost me the match with the low blow. And at the same time, it’s SummerSlam. If you noticed, the way I gave him the low blow was exact same corner, exact same way he did it to me. So he can’t say one word about how things happened at SummerSlam.” 

On the Jack Perry photo:

“I was flying to LA and they just did a show the night before. I’d seen Roderick Strong at the airport, a buddy of mine, and we got to catch up, which was awesome. He was heading to an ROH show I believe. And then on the flight, just saw Jack, had a little chat with him and his missus, and then we snapped a picture, and the internet had a freaking meltdown. It was hilarious.” 

How long did it get to stay up for?

“I think it lasted 45 minutes. The numbers I heard were 2 million impressions or something insane for 45 minutes. It was pretty wild. People enjoyed that immensely. So, yeah, I’m always dancing on that line of what’s acceptable, not acceptable. Make people question things.” 

Do you know where that line is?

“That’s probably back of 100 yards that way. That’s where I live. And yeah, I just do what was fun. And then Did someone tell me? Didn’t someone tell me? Was it by design? Did I choose to remove it? I’ll never answer that question, because I love people asking questions.”

Is there a particular line you’re proud of when it comes to insulting CM Punk?

“I could write a book the size of War and Peace about the amount of lines I’ve used, because I’ve been holding it all together since January, did 99.9% of the heavy lifting. So, yeah, I’ve got so many. One I like in particular. My wife doesn’t think I’m funny at all. Thankfully, the boys, and a lot of the fans do. But I was in the shower, I remember, I shouted her. I was like, Caitlin, come here. She runs through thinking something’s wrong. I said I need you here for a line, she goes oh God what? I was like Punk is Straight Edge. He doesn’t do drugs, he doesn’t drink, doesn’t smoke, doesn’t do anything. So what’s the line? I was okay. Here’s what’s ironic about CM Punk. He’s straight edge, doesn’t drink, doesn’t do drugs, yet he spends all this time in rehab. She just rolled her eyes. He’s on TV not long after and it was during the Chicago everyone talks about. And again, that was one of my favorite moments. Whatever I feel about him personally, when he’s on, he’s not always on and I crush him on the mic, he was on in Chicago, and we went back and forth, like I mentioned, Seth, and I like, OK, corral, like, verbal bombs on each other. And he got the one at the end where I was like, All right, he wins this one in Chicago because I’m not gonna go down there, because I’m not willing to hurt the company or whatever. That’s kind of person I am, a company guy. He plays the company guy, wears the suit, kisses all the corporate ass. I don’t do any of that stuff, but I do the stuff that actually matters, like not hurting the company’s image.”

On the WrestleMania 39 match with Gunther and Sheamus:

“I’d say bell to bell, the fact that it was at WrestleMania that could be the best match, probably is the best match of my career. I mean, how can you top being at WrestleMania, having a match that people say is one of the greatest Mania matches of all time, but perhaps the greatest Triple Threat of all time, and also the history I have with Sheamus? For the past 20 years, in the ring and out the ring, everything we’ve gone through together, and then adding Gunther, was somebody who’s just very similar to us, such an incredible physical in-ring talent. Put us all together and it was amazing. I remember not even 10 minutes into the match. Think it was after Sheamus gave me about 40 beats to the chest and the face. Nice. And then the crowd went crazy, and they’re chanting I believe this is awesome. And I was like, wow, we’re not even getting started. Wait till you see and also, why am I seeing double at this point? That was cool. And the story for the match was cool as well, because eventually Gunther disappeared for a while, and Seamus and I have always dreamed about our one-on-one match at WrestleMania. And we went back and forth for 10 straight minutes, claymores and brogues and hitting our bombs. It was like we’re having that singles match. We forgot about Gunther, and at the right moment, he just reappears. Boom, steals it, heads out. So that was cool as well that Sheamus and I kind of got a one-on-one match at Mania we should have had the year prior.”

On if CM Punk’s return and his reaction planted a seed:

“There was no seed being planted. I was just angry. I left the ring and I stormed out. I mean, try to talk about it. I was pissed off. [That he was there? That you didn’t know about it?] I guess a number of things I can understand, business reasons that’s not for me to make those decisions personally. Yeah, I was pissed off, and I chose to leave the arena because I’m not going to cause an incident that’s going to affect everybody’s mood afterwards and the guys in the match that worked so hard. People asked me about Seth’s and my reaction, maybe that was Seth’s legit reaction, but to me, I couldn’t have stood out there if somebody’s that close to me that I don’t like that much. I wouldn’t stand and swear and have people hold me back. I would have walked right up to him and punched him in the face, so I chose to leave the building. I mean I get to do that now, and it’s amazing. I guess we’re good to make money for a hatred for each other.”

What is Drew McIntyre grateful for?

“Family, health and the wife.”

Damian Priest (@ArcherOfInfamy) is a professional wrestler currently signed with WWE. He sits down with Chris Van Vliet in Cleveland, OH to discuss his Money in the Bank victory in 2023 that led to his World Heavyweight Championship reign that began at WrestleMania 40, wrestling Bad Bunny at Backlash in Puerto Rico and what that match meant to him, his time in The Judgment Day, his friendship with Rhea Ripley, R-Truth getting him to break character live TV, nearly giving up on his dreams of becoming a professional wrestler, what a Gunther chop feels like and more.

Quote I’m thinking about: “The magic you are looking for is in the work you are avoiding.”

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On everything taking place so quickly:

“I mean, it has. Somebody put it in perspective the other day, I’ve been on the main roster for three years. When you really think about all the stuff that’s happened in the last three years, this is wild. So it’s a lot being thrown at me, and then it’s one of those things that is, they say, enjoy the moment. It’s kind of hard to when you got to look forward at what’s next and what’s next and what’s next. Every once in a while I’ll take a breath and look around and like, wow. But it’s one of those things that, yeah, it’s a lot, but this is what I wanted.” 

On appreciating the moments:

“Like I said, you gotta take a breath and really think about it, even if it’s while you’re laying in bed or just on a car ride to the building, on a bus to the next town, or whatever it is, look around and really appreciate this is a different life, something that you couldn’t have even envisioned but you wanted. Those are the moments that I take to really appreciate it. Every now and then it hits me hard, especially, like I said, when I’m alone and I have a day home off, I just really think about everything and I’m in awe of everything that’s happening around me. Like, I don’t know how this happened, but I’m happy it did.” 

On the night after he won the World Championship:

“If I’m being honest, it was emotional. I partied with my friends and family afterwards. We had a celebration, it was a great time. But then when I got back to my room, it was kind of one of those things where I was like, What is this? How is this happening? And yet, just holding the title in my hand, looking at it, and just it was like one of those things, like, my entire life flashed, everything I had to go through to get to that point. It was one of those realizations of I thought I had regrets. I thought I wished I could do things differently, and then it was one of those things where it was like no, this is exactly where I’m supposed to be, and this is the only way it would have happened.”

On nearly giving up on WWE:

“I gave up on the idea of working for WWE. You know, I tried multiple times to get in and in 2017 when I got an email saying nothing for you here. I gave up and I was just focused on you know what? Let me just live a happy life and figure it out. Then they called me, which is crazy how that worked. When I gave up, that’s when they wanted me. It wasn’t like I gave up the dream of wrestling. I was still wrestling. So I was like, I guess I’ll just stay in Ring of Honor. I get to wrestle, and that’s what I wanted to do anyway and it’s cool. It was small at the time, but it was still a television program. So I was like, Hey, I’m on TV. I’m doing what I wanted to do when I was a kid. It’s okay. Then here we are in the WWE. So yeah, even in WWE, there were many times I looked around and seeing everybody and how people, some of them are progressing faster than others. Although it happened fast for me, there were still times that I wasn’t sure if it was going to be like that. Maybe it’s cool that I made it, but this is it. It was one of those things like I don’t know if I belong, I don’t know what the future is going to be, and not that I gave up, but that I did doubt. And I was like, I don’t think this is going to happen. I never thought I was gonna be world champ.” 

On pushing past the doubt:

“So I was never a believer in the power of positivity till I decided to change my life around. When I have those moments of doubt, it’s like all right, well, even though you doubt, still strive for that. Because even if you don’t make it, you’re gonna encounter a lot of cool stuff on the way, on the journey. If you put your best foot forward, you give it everything you got, and you work your ass off for your own dream and your own goals. Even if you don’t make it to the finish line, the stuff you’re gonna experience and accomplish on that route, you’re gonna be proud. I mean, there’s no way you’re not. So that’s what kept me pushing.”

On who inspired him to wrestle:

“There’s a lot, but the main one was The Undertaker. I’ve never been shy about that one. That was my idol, watching him. It wasn’t even so much the wrestling, it was just the aura, the presentation, everything. I remember how I felt, and then that’s when I knew I needed to make people feel this way. Because I was big into comics, I wanted to be a comic book superhero or supervillain, where people are that emotionally invested in me, like even as a little kid I knew that. Maybe I couldn’t articulate it that way, but I knew that. Then obviously, I saw Razor Ramon, who I legit thought was a Latino, as a little kid you don’t know the difference. I’m sure my dad knew, this guy had a fake accent, but I didn’t know. I sort of was like, Yo, he’s one of us. Then as you get older, you learn of other wrestlers. Sting was another one, I loved Sting. Still do. Just the character, especially when it became The Crow, and I thought it was the coolest thing. And then Attitude Era obviously happened and I was in high school, so Austin and Rock were my favorites. Obviously, Taker was always there, then DX. I was a Bret fan but then nWo took over, and then that was it for me, you know, nWo all the way. But I would watch WCW just for the nWo, and then that’s it. nWo and some of the cruiserweights, then I would switch back.”

On when things started to shift:

“I think the first, because I’ve morphed a few times, but I think the first big jump was after my match with Finn Balor at In Your House at the Performance Center, just during the COVID era. I don’t know, I can’t even explain what happened that day. It was just something clicked, and I just let loose. I remember getting to the back and Shawn and Hunter were waiting for me, and he was like, that’s the guy I need to see from now on, there’s no going back that guy that guy that was out there, that guy’s money, you have to be that guy always, stop pretending. Hunter told me and it’s cool because he gave me advice that I guess Taker had given him. And he goes, Taker told me this once, when you learn how to just be yourself, you’re gonna make a lot of money in this business. Then he was like, I know that’s weird, because how the hell do you not know yourself? It’s you. And sure enough, I was like, yeah, what the hell does that mean? And then I figured it out. It’s just we try to be a version of ourselves that we think everybody else expects, which is not you, you’re still pretending. I think now is the closest to really me that you see, especially with The Judgment Day and Rhea, you saw a different version of me. I like that I could show off different layers, like, when I did work with Truth, that just showed a different layer to me like, Oh, I’m a normal person, but still, I’ll kill you. But, yeah, going back, it was that moment with the match with Finn Balor. He just brought something else out of me. And then Finn and I became boys after that match, because I was like, I’d love to do that again. And he was ecstatic about it, and he chose me. At the time, I think he was supposed to go into a program with Gunther, the pandemic happened, they just couldn’t work. And I think they asked him, like, Well, who would you like to work with? And he picked me, and I’m grateful for it.”

On R-Truth:

“Ah Ronnie, that guy. I mean, look, it goes without saying at some point we’re gonna have to team, we’re gonna have to properly. The guy is unbelievable how talented of a performer, actually, I can’t even say he’s a performer that’s him. Because we’re in the locker room or backstage, just walking by off camera and the guy has me in tears sometimes laughing. It’s unbelievable how funny he is, and it’s just his natural way of being. He’s just a funny guy and really lovable person. So everything you see on TV that’s real, that’s why. And it’s clear as day that he broke me a few times.”

On when R-Truth cracked him the worst:

“Oh, man, there’s a few. The one that always comes to mind is we were in the ring and he said something about I could see it in your eyes or something. I turned around because I was supposed to be serious, I wanted to be serious in that moment for me. I wasn’t told to, but I wanted to be serious. So I turned around to laugh, and the cameraman is right there on me, and that’s what showed on TV was me laughing and then turning back around serious. That one always stands out to me because it was in the ring, but there’s a bunch of backstages that I just couldn’t help it. It is what it is.” 

When Backlash in Puerto Rico was announced:

“When it became official, because what a lot of people don’t know is that there was back and forth that it almost didn’t happen in Puerto Rico. Plain and simple, I don’t think we would have done the match if it wasn’t in Puerto Rico, we were only going to do the match if it was in Puerto Rico. So when they announced Backlash in Puerto Rico, I was like, Okay, this is real. This is happening. The island is getting a little shout-out, we get to represent. And for me it was always, of course, I’m a very proud Puerto Rican, but it was just representing the Latin community, all Hispanics. That, to me was opening the doors for a lot of stuff. And I’m not saying that Puerto Rico did, but look at how many PLEs we’re doing outside the immediate. I feel like the crowd reaction there got the company excited for man, let’s see what else they can do. So we were excited and thrilled for that representation. Obviously, I was nervous that the idea of this has got to be really good. It’s me versus Bad Bunny one on one in a high-profile match, this isn’t just a typical celebrity match, they do two or three moves, and it’s hi and bye. We’re gonna go 20-plus minutes, have to get everybody emotionally invested into this. And it’s more than just again, just people clapping hands for a celebrity. People needed to feel sympathy, excitement, fear, you know, all of it, that’s what you want. So that there was nerves. In that sense, I knew that the work was going to be put in on Bunny’s side, like I did not worry about him not being ready. But you never know of how things are going to play out.” 

On being the leader of the match:

“I would think there had to have been a concern in the office too. Like, yes, there’s confidence in me, but at the same time, they had to have been like did we make the right decision here?”

Clearly, they did not make the wrong decision.

“Thank you. I don’t think so either, and I don’t think they do either. But I’m sure beforehand, because there was talk of changing it to a tag match. But at the same time, Bad Bunny and I were very adamant. We were like we don’t want to do a tag match, and I was proud of that one. Because, obviously I helped train Bad Bunny. I pieced this match together the way I envisioned it, and he did as well. He had input, and he had great ideas, and then I was very adamant about all the representation. I wanted to use the LWO, I requested Carlito and Savio maybe requested it under the guise of, you know, Bad Bunny thought it was a good idea [laugh]. But they added so much, especially for the crowd. It was a cool moment, it wasn’t a typical match. So it’s like, Well then let’s go all out. If we’re going to do it, let’s go all out. And it was great that everybody was receptive and they thought it was the right move and clearly it was. I mean, every moment of that match, I thought was great. Hands down my favorite match, just because of what it represented. It was bigger than any win or loss.”

On what hurt Bad Bunny the most in the match:

“When we were training, and it was one of those things, I was like, we got to train a little harder than we did the last time. I explained to him, I was like, I’m gonna hit you really hard, I have to. This is one on one, it’s a street fight. I was like, I need you to not hold back like you’re in a street fight for real, give me all you got. I was like, I’m not gonna give you all I got because you’ll die, but I’ll give you a lot. And I did, and I gave it to him. That was the one thing like you got to respect the guy that’s not from this business. His body is not used to taking that much physical impact and he kept on getting up. Granted he told me that it took him a few weeks to recover, and he messaged me like three days after, and he was like, I finally feel good enough to walk around like he was, he was like, I barely come out of my bedroom, I’ve been so much pain, I feel like I’ve been in a train wreck. And I think the worst thing for him was one of the Kendo stick shots, and I only got one. He gave me like 20 of them. I gave him one shot, but I did tell him. I was like, I’m only gonna hit you once. Don’t worry. And he goes, Oh, okay. He goes, You sure? I was like, Yeah, I’m sure. And it was one I swung like a baseball bat.”

On being unsure that he would cash in his Money in the Bank contract at WrestleMania:

“No, no, that’s one of those things like we’ll see what happens. When I won the briefcase, I wasn’t sure if I was going to cash in that night. They don’t tell you everything, just putting that out there. And other people think that we know. They might have a long-term plan, which I know they did, yeah, but they don’t really articulate it fully to you, probably for the main reason. Also the reason of, they don’t want you to get amped up and hyped, and then, sorry, things change, then you’re heartbroken, because that’s not cool, either. So I’m pretty sure they like to keep it [secret], but when they do tell you, they tell you things can change. So take it with a grain of salt type of thing.”

On winning his first World Championship at 41 years of age:

“The world has changed. When they say my age out loud, like you just did, it reminds me of like, oh, wow, I actually am that age. But I don’t think that way. I don’t feel that way. Maybe because I am immature, I don’t know [laughs].”

On changing his finisher as Cody Rhodes was coming back to WWE:

“That was pretty much the conversation. Actually, they didn’t say you can’t do it anymore. It was like a conversation of look, obviously, it’s a similar move, it’s different, but it’s still similar. I do it differently, but it’s one of those things. They’re like, you might want to [change it], but they never said change it. And even Cody was like, You don’t have to change it. I was like, Yeah, but if you come back and I’m doing this move every time I hit it, people are gonna think of you. But at the end of the day, it is a rolling cutter, right? So I was okay with it. So basically, anytime I face Cody, I’m gonna hit him with it [laughs]. But look, it’s a move. It’s not that serious. I think everybody else thinks it’s more serious than we do. I really didn’t care. I was like, Okay, I’ll just go back to using the South of Heaven or Razor’s Edge or the flat liner that I do. I wasn’t sure which one I wanted to use. I haven’t even started using submissions yet, and I’ve got a few! That’s what I mean, there’s a lot of stuff that we can do. I wasn’t mad, I wasn’t upset, I just didn’t want everyone to think of him every time that I did a move. It’s one thing paying homage to somebody, it’s one thing to do a move similar to someone who works somewhere else, but when they work in the same company, on the same show, it’s like alright, there’s got to be a difference.”

On what a Gunther chop feels like: 

“I can’t even, there’s no explanation, there’s nothing you can compare it to. I don’t know, grab a frying pan and have somebody swinging as hard as they can against your chest. But him and Drew, these guys just with these heavy hands, just ginormous people, and they’ve perfected the art of slapping, which is crazy. It’s ridiculous. It’s brutal. I mean, you’ve seen it. It sucks. Like, there’s no other word for it. It sucks. I hate being marked up like that, and it doesn’t go away right away. You’re just marked up and you take a shower, it hurts. Take a deep breath, it hurts. You put on a t-shirt. It hurts, like it all hurts. So, yeah, not fun.”

What is Damian Priest grateful for?

“To help my family, that I have changed my life around and that my story can inspire others.”

Kayla Braxton (@TheKaylaBecker) is a former WWE host and backstage interviewer. She sits down with Chris Van Vliet at West Coast Creative Studio in Hollywood to talk about her decision to leave WWE on her own terms and why it was time to explore other opportunities, her Madison Square Garden send-off from Cody Rhodes, interactions with Paul Heyman, choosing to bet on herself, being done with professional wrestling, her upcoming role in the movie “Stranglehold” from Director/Writer Clark Duke, advice for anyone looking to get into the broadcasting world and more!

Quote I’m thinking about: “Well done is better than well said.” – Benjamin Franklin
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On post-WWE life:

“I feel really good. I think anytime you’re somewhere for so long and it becomes such a big part of your life, I think it was difficult for me to know how I was going to feel when I stepped away. I’ve had a little bit of FOMO when I see the show is on, or see my friends posting about their matches and stuff backstage, but I feel really good. I think I made the right decision. It was definitely time for me to go. There was nothing negative about my reason for leaving. It was just done everything I can do there, I’ve hit the ceiling at this time. At that point, I was just kind of wasting my time, and I think everybody else’s time. Someone else could be moving into my spot, and then I could be moving on to the next part of my life. So I’m really at peace with it.”

On expectations when she signed 8 years ago:

“I definitely didn’t think I was going to be there for eight years. I think I came in thinking, all right, this is a new thing, wrestling. I’m going to learn it. I’m going to get some new skills, and then move on. That was kind of the idea that I had in my head, but it locked me in way longer than I thought. But no, not at all. Never thought I would end up hosting a morning show for the better part of four years that’s grown into what it was, and hosting shows with Paul Heyman and becoming part of a storyline with Paul Heyman. No, but I think every single step that I had in WWE, I wouldn’t have changed anything.”

On handing in her notice:

“I think it’s something I’ve been kind of contemplating for a while. I think once I stepped down from The Bump, I moved to Los Angeles, it was very clear I was kind of trying to find what my next phase of life was going to be, career-wise. And I think the company kind of acknowledged that as well, and they were very supportive. When I moved out to LA they put a studio in my apartment. They wanted me to continue doing The Bump until I was like, Okay, I think it’s time that Megan Morant takes over this role full-time, and you have your studio crew in Stamford. Then I feel like on SmackDown, it’s hard, it’s a two-hour show, so there’s not a lot of room for backstage interviews on SmackDown. You gotta, gotta get the stories in there. So I wasn’t doing much backstage at SmackDown, and then I wasn’t really doing the kickoff show panels anymore. So I was just kind of seeing the writing on the wall a little bit and just thought, you know, I feel good at where my life is outside of WWE. So I just thought it was, and while everybody was getting long, everything was amicable. The company was very supportive of me stepping down too, the door is always open. It was very nice to hear. But yeah, it was just everything was just the perfect timing to do that.”

On the send-off at Madison Square Garden:

“So Madison Square Garden. I was gonna have this send-off party after the show. So I’m all ready, it’s 30 minutes left of the show, It’s my last day, I’ve done my interview, I’m in party mode. Okay, this is where I send off. And one of the writers came up to me, Oh yeah, and said, Don’t leave. No, it was Kusama. We love Kusama. She said, Kayla, don’t leave. I say, why? She goes Triple H said don’t leave. I was like, Are they, like, probably gonna have me for the plan B, if the show runs short, gotta run out there. I’m ready for my tequila. So then I start thinking, Oh, they’re about to do something. And then I get brought to Gorilla, Stephanie McMahon is there, Triple H is there. I just talked to Nick Khan and then I knew they were about to do something for me. I didn’t know it was gonna be Cody. And so, yeah when I talk about it still kind of surreal that as an announcer for WWE, I got a send-off like that with the biggest star in the company at the world’s most famous arena.”

On betting on herself:

“I just think having more control over [things]. I’ve always been so career-oriented since I was a little girl. I’ve always known I wanted to be in a TV space, and I think I’ve always worked for other people before this. Before WWE, I was working for a local TV station in Orlando, which was amazing and a great experience. But I’m like, You know what? I know what I want to do at television. I’m not a spring chicken anymore. I have a decade of experience under my belt. I want to start doing things that bring me personal joy, and I feel like the experience I have and the things I want to do, I think will be able to make an impact in the industry. So just want to take more control over it.”

On needing skills to be a backstage interviewer:

“I mean, yeah, it is true. Everyone knows it got kind of blown up online about me and LA Knight. We had an interview towards the end of my days there, and I don’t know what was going on, I think I was just really tired. He and I were going back and forth backstage, and he’s trying to get me to say Yeah! But he also just insulted me on TV, so I felt like my character wouldn’t have said Yeah! But whatever my facial expression was, the Internet was still talking about saying that I just looked like I ruined the entire promo by my reaction. But that is like, the fact that an announcer/interviewer can ruin a promo just shows how important the interviewer actually is.”

On Paul Heyman: 

“He made it really easy for me. A lot of that stuff we were kind of given the direction of how it needed to go. But everyone’s like, we’ll just do whatever Paul says. And so a lot of times it was just riffing. I just go off Paul. He’d go off me. I didn’t know what he was going to do. And we’re live, and that is a terrifying place to be! But it always did well. I feel like it always got a lot of positive reactions. I never got into any trouble. Paul’s like, you won’t get in trouble. I’m like, ok.”

On her role in the upcoming film Stranglehold:

“So my name is Crystal, it’s a film directed by Clark Duke. So the movie, I don’t know how much [I can say] I think they put out a little bit about it, but basically it’s based in a strip club. No, I do not strip in it, don’t be weird! Basically it’s about, like, what, like this main dancer is Ashley Benson was here. She and her husband, Jake Lacy, one night decide to rob the strip club. And so, like, the manager is played by Justin Long, who I’m a huge fan of. Ron Perlman is there as one of the guys working with one of the main characters. It’s mind-boggling to even think I was in that. But yeah, I’m just, I’m one of, one of the girls. There were three other strippers castsin the show, so I was one of them. And I, again, I won’t go into much detail about my character, but yeah, it was fun.” 

On the name Kayla Braxton:

“When I was getting hired, they were like, Okay, we need a new last name for you. Can you help us choose one? [At Least they let you keep Kayla]. I know, that would have been a harder thing to transition out of, but I was okay, I just want to keep my initials. I want to keep KB. So I gave them, a list of 10 B names, and they didn’t choose any of them. They said, All right, you’re Kayla Braxton. I’m like, what? Why did you even ask my opinion? But no, it’s a good name. It’s a strong name. I know I definitely don’t hate it. But it’s hard, even now I catch myself saying I’m Kayla Braxton. No, I’m Kayla Becker. It’s so hard to get back into it.”

On being done with wrestling:

“Yeah, I think so. That’s one thing about our fans too. They think, oh, you leave WWE, you must be going to AEW or Only Fans, it’s like the only two options that they think that you have. I’m like, actually, I’m doing neither. I think wrestling will always be like a love of mine and always be a family of mine. But I think I just really didn’t want to pigeonhole myself as a host and a broadcaster and just see what else I can do out there. I mean, there’s always the possibility that maybe I pop back in for a fun cameo or something down the road. But yeah, I think my time is done.”

On advice for aspiring broadcasters:

“I think learn the business as much as you can outside of the business. Definitely be very respectful, because it’s a culture, WWE is such a culture. Don’t overstep, that’s something I’ll definitely say, don’t overstep. Don’t keep harassing people in the office about wanting a job. But come to shows, shake some hands and yeah, I think if you’re the right fit, it’ll be seen. There are very few spots and definitely spend time deciding who’s going to fill those spots. So if you’re meant to be in that spot, you will be but otherwise just keep at it. Do interviews on your own. You do something that Chris is doing, really hone in those skills, because we’ve seen many times we hire someone get in that spot and they don’t last a month or two because they don’t have the interview chops. So I’d say yeah just work on it.”

What is Kayla Braxton grateful for?

“To have this time, friends and family and that Halloween Horror Nights starts next month.”