Booker T (@bookertfivex) is a pro wrestler, announcer, and 2-time WWE Hall of Famer. He sits down with Chris Van Vliet in Houston, TX to discuss being an NXT announcer and why it is more fun than being on the main roster, how he got the role as a commentator, his calls getting the likes of Trick Williams and Stephanie Vaquer over, being chased by Stone Cold while playing bingo in church, The Shockmaster’s debut, the last time he did a Harlem Hangover, being challenged to a match by Trick Williams, and more!
There are so many people who put their time in, they retired, and they’re on to other things. You still love it?
“I planned on retiring a long time ago from wrestling. But as far as mainstream, as far as WWE and stuff like that, I planned on that going away a long time ago. I didn’t expect to be in it this long, at all. But that’s why I built the wrestling school because I hear so many guys, like old guys. I’m one of those old guys now, but I hear so many old guys get out of business and then they complain, they’re bitter, you know what I mean? They’re talking about the shows. They’re critiquing the shows. I say, instead of doing that, I’m gonna just build my own, create my own stories, and still have a great love for the business. Something that has given me so much. I wouldn’t be where I am today without the wrestling business.”
How much do you think being a commentator right now has just kept you relevant in the eyes of a fan?
“I always say that sometimes it may take someone else to keep you relevant. People say respect your elders, but I say you got to respect your young guys these days because they’re the future. It’s like when Bad Bunny made the song, Bad Bunny was keeping me relevant in a totally different genre. Then working with the young guys now, and they go out there and look at all the banners around. Over WrestleMania weekend I see the blueprint and the footprint of Reality of Wrestling all over so many different shows, it’s amazing. So for me I’m just living my best life.”
How did you get this job to be a commentator in WWE?
“This thing goes back to WCW. It’s just one of those things where every time we were on the road overseas, I was the commentator in the back for the boys, in front of the monitor. I just would be having fun, and I would give guys different names; I would name their moves totally different names. I would just be way over the top with it, so it was just something I did to pass time, and the boys liked it. When you’re out on the road, you got to figure out a way to pass time more than anything.”
But how’d that turn into you getting the job that you have now in WWE?
“Well, when I came to WWE, same thing. I was on the road, doing commentary on the road.”
Just making the guys laugh?
“When I was wrapping my career up, Michael Cole, he came to me and he was like, ‘How would you like to start doing commentary and get on the commentary team?’ What are you talking about? I can’t do that, and he was like, ‘I think you could do it.’ I love Michael Cole. He’s always been my biggest supporter. I wouldn’t be doing commentary if it wasn’t for Michael Cole putting me on the team and trusting me for some damn reason. I would screw up so many times. One day on television I go, ‘I want to see a f*cking fight.’ I’m like, what the hell? I didn’t mean for that to come out. Cole goes, ‘What did you just say?’ I go, What did I just say? I didn’t even realize I said it. And the thing is, I knew I would be screwing up.
But he would still keep trusting me, I just didn’t understand it, and a lot of times I was like I just know they’re gonna take me off the team sooner or later. Sooner or later, that day came for me. I was doing SmackDown, I was doing Raw, and then they came to me one day and they go ‘Book, we’re gonna take you off commentary, but we’re gonna leave you on the kickoff show. It’s nothing wrong or anything like that.’ I go guys, I was gonna come talk to you guys about it. I was so happy that day. Graves thought I was crazy because they took me off the team, and I was so happy because I just knew I wasn’t ready for that. I knew I wasn’t. Then they end up putting me back on again, and they end up taking me off again. But then the NXT gig [came along].”
You being on NXT looks like you’re just having the time of your life!
“You know what? I always tell the story of when I was doing commentary my first time around under the Vince regime, and he came into my ear and he goes, ‘Hey, Book, say “much to his chagrin.”‘ I didn’t even know what that meant. First of all, chagrin? I’m thinking about the chin area. I’m just saying, and I look at the camera, got those little cameras that’s looking at us. I knew if I said that, all my street cred would have been gone. So I couldn’t really be myself on Raw and SmackDown. But when I came to NXT, Shawn Michaels was just like, ‘Just be you. Whatever you want to do, just do it.’ I remember after the first night I did commentary in NXT, and I came back through the curtain. Shawn goes, ‘Man, I don’t know what you were saying, but I liked it.’ So I was like, Oh man, I love this. So being able to be down there in NXT, it’s so refreshing to be myself. But it’s really, really cool also because I used to be one of those kids, and I know about making mistakes. When I see them make mistakes, I can call it out. I can critique them from a certain disposition, as opposed to the guys on the main roster. I see the guys on the main roster making mistakes. It’s a little bit harder to critique them because they’re supposed to be pros. They’re supposed to have everything, but with the young guys, they’re still learning. So that’s why for me it’s so refreshing. As well as I get a chance to work with them hands-on. I’m a teacher at heart. I love teaching and explaining and trying to get you to understand. You know what chess is all about, because you just can’t run into a chess game and start moving pieces. You gotta really strategize if you want to be really, really good at chess.”
I feel like you helped to get Trick Williams over so much. With his entrance in NXT, was that just something that naturally happened?
“You know, I love working with Vic, he is like the maestro. He’s the guy that’s directing traffic. So a lot of times he’s like this right here, that means just lay out. I get it. You do your damn job. Do your job. But sometimes, you got to know when to let things flow, and that’s what’s really cool about Vic and I. He’s realized when it’s time to let me let things flow, lay out. I remember the day Trick came out, and I don’t know, I was just feeling it, and I think I might have had a cup of coffee and two espressos. I swear it. I was so jacked up that night. My heart was beating. I was sweating, it’s like one of those type of deals. Got the little headache, but everything was just right. and the building was just hot. And when Trick came out, I just thought, ‘What?’ ‘Yeah!’ Then I go, ‘Uh. Say what?’ ‘I like it.’ ‘Oh yeah, man.’ I just kept saying it, and then I just talked him all the way into the ring, and then the music stopped, and Vic hit the little button, the silent button. He goes, ‘Do that every week.’ So you know, we got a really, really good chemistry, and Vic has really helped me find myself as a commentator.”
I love how you’re talking about how good Vic is. I’ve known Vic for a long time. I think he might be the most underrated commentator in all of wrestling right now.
“It’s just a matter of being in the right place at the right time. I think that’s it more than anything. We’re talking about Joey Styles just not too long ago because I’m kind of like Joey Styles a little bit. I love Joey Styles, the ah yeah! I love that. He was such a great commentator and such a great analyst, his story and everything. He did everything. He did it all by himself when he was in ECW, but when he came to WWE, he was just in the wrong place at the wrong time. I think Vic, his first time around, he was just in the wrong place at the wrong time. It was just not his time yet. He had to season himself and really hone his craft, more than anything. I know he gives me a lot of credit, but I think when I came to NXT, it was my job to give him that confidence to know that he can do this and he’s better than just about anybody at it on any given night if given the opportunity. So a lot of commentators Vic has been with, they want to share the spotlight. I don’t try to share the spotlight, I want to give them all the spotlight, as well as all the responsibility, because I don’t want to do no reads.”
The Stephanie Vaquer spot with the devil’s kiss, how did that come about? Your commentary on that.
“Again, the soundtrack. It’s one of those things to where if you got a talent that’s out there and they’re doing something, and it’s good but it doesn’t really have a soundtrack to it it’s not gonna have that same feel it’s not gonna have that same punch. I learned that when I was coming up because of Spinneroonie and Mark Madden. Spinneroonie wouldn’t have been the Spinneroonie. I give Mark Madden all the credit out of Pittsburgh, that was just so over the top when he saw it. ‘Spinneroonie!’ I’m like, what? What is that? I better do more of this. People start buying into it. I didn’t know the Spinneroonie was my signature. I didn’t know that until Mark Madden made it my signature. I was like, “Oh sh*t! That’s my signature. And then, with Stephanie Vaquer, I said that move needs some sound for the people to actually get on board and really accent it. ‘Ah, ah, ah!’ So many people tried to give me grief about it, because they try to make it sound like, what is Booker T doing? I’m like, go along with the ride and let’s see where this thing goes, and then when the whole arena is doing it, and then the t-shirts come out and the merch, then let’s talk about it. So for me, everything I do, everything is all for the talent. It’s all for the young talent to get over.”
Your first three feuds in WWE were Stone Cold, The Rock, and Kurt Angle. So many guys from WCW got instantly buried when they came over. How did you get these opportunities?
“I always say you got to know how to make it in the locker room before you have a chance at making it in the ring. When I came into WWE, I had to get those guys to trust me, and I had to gain that trust. I had to keep my head down and do things a certain way, as far as let me show these guys how good I am, as well as hey, he’s not that bad of a guy. So they instantly gave me a chance. So I was put with the top guys, I think, for a reason too, just to see if these guys took to me, if they were gonna go back and take a report back and say, I don’t know about this guy. I always tell my students, everything is a test. Don’t think nothing isn’t a test in this business. I didn’t care what they threw at me back then. I knew I was gonna pass the test,. So I used to love working with Pat Patterson because he would give me a match, and he would say, ‘Go out and do it this way, gi-ging.’ Gi-ging, that’s where that come from. Yeah, this way, and then bing zip, ging, and it’s over with, and that was the match. And then I would go, I love it. So I didn’t care. Just give me the instructions, and I’m gonna go out here and deliver it, just like you just explained it to me gigi gigi gigi. I wanted to be able to fit in and fit in properly and gain those guys’ respect. I remember, I don’t know, maybe six months in, might even be sooner than that. I came in one day, and I was going to the locker room, and Undertaker say, ‘Hey, man, why don’t you come dress over here with us?’ I went dressed over there with those guys, and it was where the big guns dress, wasn’t a lot of guys, not a lot of baggage in there, you know. So, felt like I was in from that point.”
I loved when you were feuding with Stone Cold and you did the bingo. What do you remember from that day?
“I remember everything from that. I remember even the suit I had on. I had the store here called Jam Zone, where we sold CDs, clothing items, from New York, and I had this brown outfit. I remember that’s why I got it from New York warehouse district. I don’t know, maybe 30,40, bucks, but it looked good. It looked sharp. But I remember having so much fun doing those skits. I remember just totally going into a totally different mode. I was watching some earlier today actually, and it was just me doing a skit talking about a movie role that I was auditioning for, and it was about The Rock. I was trying to remember it. I was like, I don’t even remember this, but it was so stupid. It was so funny and that’s what I got a chance to do. Like with the bingo stuff, with the old lady, the bait and switch, and it just was stupid.”
You’re yelling at this old lady!
“‘What are you looking at?!’ I had so much fun doing that part of the business, that side. Wrestling is not just wrestling. It’s so much more.”
I don’t know if this gets talked about enough, but you were there for the disastrous debut of Shockmaster
“Sid put us right in the spotlight in WCW with that with Shockmaster and Davey and Sting and those guys, Vader. I’m like, you got to be kidding me, and it was my first pay-per-view. We were in the main event in Houston. I was like, how the hell did this happen? We’re doing that scene with the Shockmaster. The thing is, a lot of people don’t realize we rehearsed that thing early. We went over it, but somehow I think the wall that they had, they wanted to be a little bit sturdier. So they put that board down at the bottom, and I don’t think anybody told Fred. Fred had the mask on. He couldn’t see nothing. It wasn’t a great idea from Jump Street, even though we just used it around here not too long ago.”
What were you thinking when he collapsed through the wall?
“I was so green and so young. I just tried to keep a straight face. I just tried to keep my composure, and Sid goes. ‘I told you.’ That’s what Sid said. I didn’t want to laugh. Yeah, it was one of those moments. I felt really, really bad for him because the helmet came off, the glitter went off, and I hate glitter. You get glitter on me, it’s just one of my phobias. It was all over the place, and you just knew things were going to change for him after that too.”
When do you think was the period of your career when you were having the absolute most fun?
“When I was with Sharmell as King Booker, I don’t think nothing could have been more fun than that. Then when we were in TNA too, we had a lot of fun. It was like a vacation. Still getting paid.”
When people ask the question of if you could change the finish of any match, what would it be? I feel like it always comes back to your WrestleMania 19 match against Triple H. Was there ever talk of you winning that match?
“You know, to answer that first part, that would be the only match in my career that I could honestly say, maybe if I could change that finish, I would change it. But no, there was never any talk about me winning that match from the beginning; I never went into that match thinking I was winning. But there again, I’ve never gone into any match thinking that. I just never got involved in that side of it. I know so many people wanted me to win, and I love those people for it. I always said when I got in the business, I just hope I’m in the main event at WrestleMania one day. Then I got in the main event and I didn’t win. I go, man, I should have wished I would have won too. It’s one of those types of things, but the story was a great story, and anyway you look at it, I always looked at it was stories that was as real as it possibly could be for me, and most people wouldn’t understand it. Most people wouldn’t understand it. I get it, because it’s something that’s fictional to them, but it’s real to me. When I say that, I lost my dad when I was 10 months old, and I lost my mom when I was 14, quit school and got locked up in prison. Then I come out and find myself in the main event at WrestleMania. I think that’s a win. Any kid that’s looking at it, I needed them to understand I’m that kid that went through all that trial and tribulation, but yeah, found myself being one of the best wrestlers in the world, in the main event at WrestleMania, I came that close to winning my sixth world title. I had five before that, but came close to winning my sixth world title at WrestleMania.”
Do you think you have another match in you? Because Trick Williams has called you out a few different times.
“You know, I don’t know what’s wrong with these young guys. I guess people calling out Mike Tyson, people calling out Floyd [Mayweather]. I know I’m one of those legends too. People wanna call me out, tried to piggyback my career, try to get some brownie points. But my thing is, can I do it? Perhaps. But I’ve scratched every itch as far as the wrestling thing goes, and you know, just like tonight, we got Summer Champions 12 going down in the building. So much young talent that’s under my expert tutelage, trying to get to that next level. I’m so focused and dialed into that. I don’t have anything to prove, but don’t get it twisted. If I had to do something, don’t think I won’t put the boots back on and step back in and slap somebody around a little bit. That easily could be done. The thing is, I still do that on a daily basis. Just never say never.”
What is Booker T grateful for?
“My family, my health, God in my life and the people around me.”
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