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Santiago Zapata (@MrSantiZap) is a podcaster and YouTuber better known as SantiZap. He sits down with Chris Van Vliet at West Coast Creative Studio in Hollywood, CA to discuss the success of his YouTube channel in a short amount of time, his reaction clips being featured on WWE TV, making sure he posts a new video every day no matter what, the John Cena retirement tour and who the final opponent might be, celebrities in wrestling, Logan Paul’s WWE career so far and more!
Quote I’m thinking about: “The windshield is bigger than the rearview mirror for a reason, because what’s in front of you is so much more important than what’s behind you”
On being a Chargers fan:
“That’s right, yeah. So, I mean, we’re talking 2005 when I got into football initially, and it was just like my buddies wanting to play Madden. We went from Halo to playing Madden. I was like, well, I need a team, right? And being from Southern Ontario, from like the Waterloo, Toronto area, for those that don’t know, Southern Ontario, there’s no NFL teams there, first of all. The closest teams were the Detroit Lions, they sucked. The Buffalo Bills, they sucked. So as a kid, I just came up with the very logical reason of picking the team that sounded closest to my name, Santiago, San Diego, literally now, because of that 20-year fandom, super fandom, I adore the Chargers. I live and breathe by that. To me, forever and always. They will be the San Diego Chargers, even though they’re in Los Angeles, but that is a genuinely a team that I live and breathe by. Now I’m just fortunate and lucky to be in a position to travel to be able to watch their games, because before I would have to wait for them to maybe have a game against Detroit Lions, maybe have a game against the Bills, and that might happen once every four years.”
On early WWE fandom:
“2001, I missed the Attitude Era. I caught the back end. So when I got into wrestling, I’m seeing the last like, six months of Stone Cold Steve Austin.”
You’re seeing WCW get bought by WWF?
“Bingo, bingo. So for me, when I think of when I got into wrestling, I think of the nWo coming to WWE, my first big show where I couldn’t see it, because I’m like, What is a pay per view, was WrestleMania 18. I had to watch WrestleMania 18 five months later, waiting outside of our public library in London, Ontario for the VHS version to arrive at the local library so I could watch WrestleMania 18.”
On writing a paper on Rock vs. Hogan:
“Yeah, technically not, but in my mind, that’s what I was going off of. It was a psychology paper on the power of nostalgia. So it was referencing how nostalgia took over the fandom in that match with Hogan being the bad guy, and then nostalgia rose-tinted glasses, that concept took over. And those people that are now adults that were kids watching Hogan, it just took over. This thing that they were supposed to follow of Rock the good guy, Hogan the bad guy, got completely thrown out the window because of the power of the dopamine that is gathered from nostalgia. I wrote it like a 15 to 20-page paper on that. And the basis of it was Rock Hogan. [I hope you got an A]. I got like a C plus.”
On posting a YouTube video every day:
“I’ve got a trip to Japan that I’m gone for 12 days, 13 days, there will be a video on YouTube regardless. That is my motto, my mentality. Because when it comes to the online space, the concept of is my video better than somebody else? That’s purely subjective, right? It’s purely up to the opinion of the viewer. I can’t necessarily control that. I can try to make the best video possible, but I can’t sway the audience’s opinion on it. What I can sway is how available I am. So I don’t think I’m the best content creator out there, but I do think I’m up there with one of the most consistent ones. So whenever you log into YouTube, we’ve made a social pact. There will be a SantiZap video there, and my side of that pact is to upload. Your side of the pact is to keep showing up and watching, and it’s worked pretty well for the past two and a half years.”
On how he gained 100,000 subscribers so quickly compared to CVV:
“It’s a different landscape back then, though, definitely, I do think that it is funny enough people think it’s harder to get into content creation now, I think it’s the easiest it’s ever been, especially because everybody has the little super computer called their iPhone where they can make content I’m thinking of like 11 years ago, like you really needed, like equipment that was only accessible to those that really wanted to dive into content creation. But now, literally anybody could be a content creator, but it’s intimidating because of how many content creators there are out there. But I promise you, if you’re listening, if you’re interested in becoming a content creator, for every content creator, there’s thousands of viewers.”
On how his content blew up so quickly:
“I think it comes down to relatability. You and I have spoken about this before, about former wrestlers wanting to start podcasts. I think they have wonderful stories, and we’ve seen former wrestlers start podcasts and YouTube channels and do well, but for everyone that does well, there’s like 50 that do horrible and can’t stay consistent and just quit, right? Because they realize it’s not that simple. I think what’s worked for me is one, consistency, but two, relatability, because I really am just a fan at the end of the day. Those wrestlers that make content you can’t relate to those guys and girls. You’re not The Undertaker. If the undertaker says something, it’s gospel. If Santizap says something, you can disagree with me all day long, because I can be wrong, because I’m just one of you guys sitting on the couch. I’m literally just a fan. I just happen to have viewers, but I am in the exact same position as everybody that watches my videos. It’s actually the reason strategically why I’ve avoided doing wrestler interviews or taking on opportunities that kind of take me out of the chair and put me into more of an industry person, because if I’m all of a sudden more ingrained in the industry, I lose my spot on the couch, and I’m no longer relatable. I’m no longer the guy at the bar that you’re watching wrestling with. I lose that relatability. So I think that’s why it’s been successful, consistency and people being able to agree and disagree with me, because I don’t have any authority in this space. I’m literally just a dude.”
On where he gets the ideas for a video every day:
“For me, my content calendar is doesn’t matter, figure it out, post something. Sometimes when wrestling is hot, it’s so easy to come up with something. Sometimes when it’s not hot, it’s like, All right, we gotta stretch something and come up with something and just throw it out there and see if it sticks. And what’s funny is that sometimes I’ll come up with a video idea and I’m like, this is terrible, but whatever, I’m posting it anyway, and it does well. It does better than I would’ve thought. So that goes with my mentality of some content is better than no content, but just stick to the plan every single day. But for me, it really is like, sometimes I’ll have five videos ready to go for the next five days. Sometimes, oh my God, my editor falls asleep in like 30 minutes, I need to come up with something, and I just have to just sit in front of the camera. And then inspiration comes in just by turning on the camera and realizing that if I don’t make something, my editor doesn’t eat, my thumbnail guy doesn’t eat. These guys are relying on me to do my daily video, and that alone maybe the pressure makes the creative juices start flowing, and the video comes out in some capacity at some point.”
On doing more than reaction content:
“For me, it’s a lot of the reaction clips [that people find me and think it[‘s all I do], which is so far from the truth. When you look at it from like an iceberg perspective, that is a tiny 1% of what I do. The intention with those reactions is, hey, hopefully you like the personality. Come find everything else that I do. But a lot of people think that all I do is react to content. I don’t. I do have a podcast, I have a Patreon. I live-stream pretty much every single major show so that I can have a community to discuss the show with. But the thing that gets the most views is usually the thing with the least amount of effort, which is the reaction content.”
On the shelf life of reaction content:
“The shelf life is the legal shelf life, until WWE decides, nah. That’s the shelf life.”
Is that what happened to your TikTok?
“Yeah. But that’s not even WWE. That’s just this automated system that TikTok has. It’s not even like across the board on all of the different platforms. So, like, they’re fine with it on Instagram, on Facebook, it’s this TikTok thing that you all of a sudden decides, no, you’re not allowed here anymore. Get out of here. But when my first TikTok got banned, and it got banned at like, 700,000 followers, that’s when I realized you can’t scale off of this. You gotta focus on the more creative sides of content creation, and unfortunately, and I say that loosely, because it’s great, there are a lot of new people trying to get into reaction content, and that’s amazing, but that’s all they’re doing. I highly encourage those individuals to try your hand at long-form content. Try your hand at live streaming, be more creative, because you cannot scale off of just reaction content. I was lucky that I got into a time where they were really loose with it, and they’re like, Sure, go ahead, use this content, reactions, whatever, but they can literally turn that off at any moment. Why should I rely my and have my livelihood hang on this thing that’s just not reliable, something that could literally disappear overnight. You gotta diversify.”
On being used on WWE programming:
“Dude, The Rock stuff, he used me for some evil propaganda. You remember when everyone hated The Rock because of the ‘We want Cody’ stuff? All right, so I was firmly in the ‘We want Cody’ side of things. I was like, I don’t want The Rock here, but I made a video talking about the positives of having The Rock here, and he used that on his own Instagram to show the world look at how much the WWE Universe loves the final boss taking Cody Rhodes’ spot. And I was so conflicted, because I was like, Well, I’m getting free promotion on the fifth biggest Instagram page on the planet, and it’s the freaking Rock. But now everyone hates me because they think I’m some sort of agent of The Rock that wants Cody Rhodes out of the picture.”
On the John Cena farewell tour:
“Hit and miss from a quality perspective, storytelling perspective. I think it’s been fantastic as an ability for me to say goodbye to John Cena, getting to see him in all different kinds of environments, getting to see him as a heel, as a babyface, interacting with those that he interacted with in the past. Him doing his ode to Adam Copeland, who’s in AEW now, most wrestlers don’t get this. Most wrestlers, that’s it, they’re just done, and they don’t even know when their last match is. We have both the fortunate and unfortunate pleasure to know when John Cena’s last match is. Fortunate because we get to say goodbye. We get to have the journey to see him go into the sunset, but unfortunate, because we get to know when it happens and it’s counting down, and it’s like starting to strangle me that my favorite, my goat, the greatest of all time, is about to leave this industry forever. And you know they say in wrestling, never say never. I believe when Cena says never.”
On the Cena heel turn not being looked upon as favourably:
“I get where you’re coming from, and him being heel allowed for matches that wouldn’t have made sense if he was a babyface. Randy Orton CM Punk that tag match against Cody Rhodes and Jey Uso, I think it was, at Money in the Bank that wouldn’t have worked if he was a babyface. So him being a heel, even though it didn’t get paid off the way that it should have, did open us up to have matches that we all were clamoring for in his retirement tour, and they were able to do it in a way where it made sense, because he was a bad guy. Again, they didn’t pay it off. It’s not his fault. He tried to take fault for that. I don’t know if you saw, he tried to take fault for the heel run not working. It’s like, no, it was not you. You were doing everything right. It was the circumstances in the third parties that were involved in your heel run that couldn’t or didn’t want to be part of it moving forward that ruined it.”
On who could be the final opponent:
“There’s the ones I want and the ones that I think. Right now we’re off the back of Wrestlepalooza, the way that ended with Brock Lesnar eating John Cena alive. I could see them wanting Brock Lesnar to be John Cena his final opponent. And I think it would make sense with how Wrestlepalooza ended. John Cena, finally conquering the beast, this guy that’s just eating him alive for his entire career. He ends his career finally exercising the demon that is Brock Lesnar. I could see it. I don’t want it. The other prototypical perfect John Cena heel is Gunther. If you look at everyone that he’s feuded with throughout the years, Gunther is like the prototypical made-in-a-lab, perfect John Cena heel. He really, really is, and we’ve already seen Gunther retire Goldberg. That could be something he chases, something like a legend killer, legend retirer. I could see Gunther also being a final opponent for John Cena. But just as of the conversation, as of the day of this conversation, Brock Lesnar is probably the one that I think they’re going to run.”
On celebrity wrestling:
“Jelly Roll, to me, is the most impressive one. Turns out he was watching my videos, listening to me being critical of him. I was never disrespectful. I’ve been very conscious of some people that I’m talking about, watch my videos. I said I think that putting in too many resources into this Jelly Roll match. Randy Orton, Logan Paul, Drew McIntyre. When Bad Bunny debuted, they gave him a mid-card Damian Priest. When it was Johnny Knoxville, they gave him a Sami Zayn that was doing nothing, but we’re putting in three main eventers with Jelly Roll? By the end of the whole feud, I basically apologize, Jelly Roll, you were amazing, fantastic. This was a great match. Brother leaves a comment on my YouTube on the review of that SummerSlam on his 4 million subscriber YouTube page, saying, watching me win you over over the last several weeks has been amazing. Man, I love that you have the pulse, that you’re listening to what fans were saying, the feedback that they were giving you, because you clearly applied it. You are somebody that gives a sh*t about this. And if Jelly Roll wants to come back 2, 3, 10 more times, I’m in!”
On his favourite match:
“Favorite is different than best. Okay, I want to make that very clear. My favorite match of all time is Kurt Angle versus Rey Mysterio from SummerSlam 2002. If there is a match to show non-wrestling fans, it is that one for the hardcore wrestling fans. You’ve always pondered that question, what match the show non-wrestling fans and so many people want to say Shawn Michaels vs. The Undertaker. Kenny Omega versus Kazuchika Okada at Wrestle Kingdom. Those matches are 40 minutes. A new wrestling fan will not sit through that. Kurt Angle vs. Rey Mysterio Summer Slam. 2002 is seven and a half minutes of the most jam-packed action that you can see. A combination of lucha and technical wrestling that is an absolute masterpiece, just eight minutes long. The commitment is low and the reward is enormous. I adore that match.”
On what is the greatest match:
“Keeping it in WWE it also depends. If we’re talking from a technical perspective, I will pick The Undertaker versus Shawn Michaels, specifically WrestleMania 25. I think that is a wonderful match. I think it’s damn near perfect, but I have a slight preference for Kurt Angle versus Shawn Michaels at WrestleMania 21. I think that is a genuinely stellar match with a wonderful finish of Shawn Michaels being locked in an ankle lock for seemingly like 20 minutes, and he is screaming, writhing in agony. If you ever want to see a believable submission hold that lasts for a long time, that’s the one. That WrestleMania 21 match is utterly fantastic.”
On what he did before content creation:
“I worked in tech and I was a senior account executive at a tech company in Waterloo, selling tech to big companies and traveling to their location to try and sell them on the software that we had. That was the job. It had nothing to do with wrestling, but I daresay might had something to do with content creation, because I was selling through Zoom, talking to people and presenting on Zoom, ‘Here’s why you should buy your thing.’ I had my sales voice. I had the sales pep, and maybe that’s something that translated nicely onto content creation, like I was doing corporate sales for a long time.”
On what made him go full-time into content creation:
“My dad, which is fascinating, because when I tell people, a lot of people think that he’d be the one that would tell me, ‘Keep your day job, son’ is like, a pretty common thing that you might hear with parents, especially somebody born in the 1950s where content creation is this, like, super foreign thing. But when it got to the point where financially, I could leave my corporate job, but I still refuse to, because I was scared, my dad’s like, ‘Well, why are you scared?’ Well, because I might fail with the content creation. ‘Well, what’s the worst-case scenario if you fail with content creation?’ I go get that job again. ‘Okay, so what is the upside with the content creation?’ I might get to do the thing that I love for the rest of my life? I’m like, That’s he says that’s the easiest trade bet, gamble that you can make. If you fail, if you lose, you literally lose nothing, right back where you started. But if you succeed, you can change your life upside down, inside and out. And that’s what’s ultimately happened. It was my dad. My dad’s like, do it. Quit. Jump into the pool. Get into the uncomfortable. Get comfortable in the uncomfortable. Because that’s the only way that you’re gonna be able to succeed in the uncomfortable.”
What is SantiZap grateful for?
“Family, wrestling and fitness.”
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